Kip: 0:11

we're three best friends and we love lost and we love talking, but even more so we love talking about lost. So join us for some laughs, good conversation and let's get lost together.

Amanda: 0:25

Hello everybody and welcome to this week's episode of let's Get Lost. I'm Wendover Covismanda and to my right is Teresa Hi, To my left is Kippy hey, and we're here to talk about the follow-up to a very emotional episode, which is followed up with a very emotional episode titled question mark.

Kip: 0:50

I guess, yeah, I guess, so Question mark. I mean, I don't love that. That's what they named it.

Amanda: 0:56

No, me neither. I don't like symbols for like, just symbols for titles.

Kip: 1:02

Me neither.

Amanda: 1:02

But I guess that's what we'd have to call it. It's question mark, yeah.

Theresa: 1:11

So this is question mark. What is question mark about? Theresa? That's me, yes. Question mark written by damon lindelof and calton cuse, directed by darren seraphian, mr echo in this vlog to help find a secret location he believes houses answers to the island's mysteries across the island, jack and the other survivors struggle to cope with the horrific situation in the hatch michael oh, and is it ever horrific it's gruesome yeah it's.

Amanda: 1:35

It's quite gruesome like oh it's well, we'll get there but holy shit was that like that's gotta be one of the more traumatizing like they've had in a. In a scenario of multiple traumatizing incidents, that's gotta be one of the most traumatizing.

Theresa: 1:49

Definitely.

Kip: 1:50

Oh yeah Brutal.

Theresa: 1:52

Messed up, yeah.

Kip: 1:54

I mean, you said, last week was a very emotional episode, and I mean this one, jesus, it just, it's almost worse. Oh, it is worse.

Amanda: 2:04

Because really the ending is just kind of shocking and emotional, and then you, it's over. Oh, and this one is just like Now. We have to live with it. It ramps it up too.

Kip: 2:12

Okay, so let's talk about it. Okay. Imdb 8.3 out of 10. Viewers 16.35 million Days 64, 65 on the island and we had a nickname. Count of Lise Freckles. Give me a number.

Amanda: 2:33

Three.

Kip: 2:34

No Four, no Five.

Theresa: 2:36

Oh we were close.

Kip: 2:39

Freckles was one.

Amanda: 2:40

That's all I remember Called.

Kip: 2:42

Doc and Jacko Calls Fenry the artist formerly known as Henry Gale.

Amanda: 2:51

That's a good one.

Kip: 2:53

My favorite of the episode. He calls Locke Gimpy the Crutch.

Amanda: 3:01

I do remember that now.

Kip: 3:03

Gimpy the Crutch oh man, that's just crutch. Oh man, that's just so funny. Oh man, Okay. So, oh shit, I didn't prepare any trivia.

Amanda: 3:13

Oh, no, Okay Well.

Kip: 3:15

I just realized because I was doing this yesterday and I totally forgot about trivia. I thought I would do it after I watched and then I was just a wreck.

Amanda: 3:23

So I didn't do anything. That's actually. You know, let's sit on that. You know, let's just sit in that. The fact that it was too emotional to do trivia after.

Kip: 3:32

Oh yeah, that was a here were my emotions, like it was just anger, a lot of anger and sorrow. So much sadness so much sadness and then just more anger at the end yeah, anytime michael came on, I was just mad.

Amanda: 4:00

Yeah, he's uh the worst, oh, the literal worst, and you know what, I don't know, I don't even you know like sometimes, when there's like a good villain you can, you can still like, respect them and you can really like them.

Kip: 4:09

No, no, not with this.

Amanda: 4:10

There's just nothing redeemable about him and to be honest, the acting's not even that phenomenal. So I'm not like, oh my god, this is like night and day acting, you know. Like it's like his acting is fine, like he's a fine actor. It's not a, it's not a criticism of him.

Kip: 4:24

He's a great actor, but like it's not that, it's just it's so irredeemable yes yeah and just like uh, okay, well, how do we want to do this? Where do we?

Theresa: 4:36

want to start?

Kip: 4:36

I don't even know it technically is an echo episode, but I feel like that almost gets forgotten.

Amanda: 4:40

100 but I think, well, I'll just say quickly I don't really have a high level takeaway for this other than the fact that we were talking about theresa and I on the way here. We're talking about how I don't remember I mean, I think it's not a spoiler to realize that at some point they're going to realize that michael's full of shit. Yeah, and I can't remember when like what they, if they figure out that he was lying about this I think he, they do, but I can't remember exactly when and I realized that I had just like a block after that, like I didn't even remember that libby survived through this episode like I think that there's like certain points in the show that like just these big action moments just kind of like leave like a blind spot after for a bit yeah

Amanda: 5:26

and so now, like I knew, I like I never forgotten, like I said last episode, I remember where anna lucia was standing and what she falls on when she gets shot. She was, but I couldn't or you know what I mean like that couchy chair thing, but I don't remember. I didn't remember that louis survived it and I and I know eventually what happens with Michael overall, but I don't remember exactly when and how they figure out that he's full of shit.

Kip: 5:49

It was like it was so big that it just shadowed the immediate aftermath.

Amanda: 5:55

It's like I have this like cliff that I jumped down and like I can't see what's next to the cliff.

Kip: 6:01

Oh, I like it. Okay, that's cool, that's cool.

Amanda: 6:05

But anyway, well, well, I think we should hear about teresa.

Kip: 6:07

Stream of consciousness also.

Theresa: 6:12

All right question mark. Oh okay, echo. Uh, what's going on here? Honest? Anna lucia seems off right now. Oh it, it's a dream. Help John to do what? Oh my god, echo's gonna see the bodies. Wait, yemi, is this still a dream? What work Help John with what? The button? What question mark? And will the wall pick? Ugh, surely they just sleep out in the open with no one else. How far is the church from everybody else? How far is the dang hatch? That it's nighttime now Seems pretty calculated of you.

Theresa: 6:50

Michael Prob. Waited inside until you heard voices and then popped out all like oh no, I'm wounded, jerk man, this is pretty upsetting. Poor Anna, lucy and Libby oh shit, is she still alive? Tell on him, libby, tell on him.

Theresa: 7:04

I'm so sad for Echo. I think he's the last of the Taileys now other than Bernard. Fuck you, michael, asking how she is. Okay, good question, sawyer. Jack can't keep trying to wander off. Someone needs to take care of Libby. Also, echo seems bored with being a priest. Oh okay, fake papers for him. And now to investigate a miracle for this woman. He really seems like he doesn't want to. Sorry for what? Oh shit, that's gotta be painful. John, are you okay? John feels different in this episode.

Theresa: 7:37

Somehow I find John and Echo together so fascinating. Okay, that tape is literally horrifying. How is Echo following John's's like makeshift little map? What the fuck is that crunch? Oh, it's another one of those statues. Oh, they made it back to the plane. The way john says the sacrifice that the island demanded. It's so here to hear lock like this.

Theresa: 8:01

When did we all find out about the heroin? When did the house lawyer get some? Why don't I remember this? Uh-oh, kate is gonna find out about the boom, boom. So he's got a nice little tent going on here. It even has windows. Oh my god, I completely forgot that she would never have come back to him last night. Oh my god, that's so sad, poor hurley.

Theresa: 8:21

Oh, the axe is for climbing. Wait, why are we climbing? What's up there? Oh, this is John's dream. Wait, how does he know what Yemi looks like? Dreams, I guess, hold great power here. How come John hasn't changed his pants?

Theresa: 8:36

Is this Claire's psychic? Oh, I think it is, and he's a liar. Good to know, poor Claire. Wait, is the fam in the US that was gonna take her baby fake then. Oh my god, look at Echo's arms. Holy smackaronis, he's so strong. Oh look, he made it.

Theresa: 8:53

What's up here? More greenery, okay, oh shit, you have to see it from above. Wait, how did he get down so fast? Oh, they found another hatch. Oh my god, they moved a whole plane. That's impressive. They found double doors. Okay, we're too nonchalant about opening doors to nowhere.

Theresa: 9:12

Aw, john is starting to feel more like John again. I mean, it would be hard not to believe after all this. Okay, poor Hurley, seriously, michael, you'd better feel even shittier. Michael, you are a son of a bitch. Oh my god, they just went down. No big deal. Didn't realize you would push a red button to turn lights on instead of a green one.

Theresa: 9:33

Um, it's really creepy down here. All those TVs in a single chair, uh, no, thanks, ryan. See those brainwashing scenes. Where do these people sleep? Do you turn all the TVs on? Oh my god, these TVs are old. Oh shit, that's their hatch in one of those videos or one of those screens.

Theresa: 9:52

I want to print the log. Print the log, john. Print the log. Yay, oh, it's timestamps. I think I don't know. Wait, where did the paper go? Now there's another film, so the question mark is the pearl. I guess A big circle could mean nothing, but hence the question mark. But it's a pearl. Oh, I see now this guy's name is Mark Wickman. Eh, okay, monitoring instead of brainwashing, that's good to know. Oh shit, I think Locke thinks the button is an experiment now, oh, he looks heartbroken. Yeah, he definitely doesn't think it's real anymore. Wait, what are we being tested for? Okay, fair question. Echo Locke looks defeated, coupled out with Fenris saying that he didn't push that button. He's devastated. Um hi, young lady, what message are you trying to send to Echo? Oh my God. Well, that's terrifying. How would she know about Yemi? I mean, you have to admit, echo makes a good point. It's got to be something rather than nothing. Oh, my God, hurley, this is not your fault, sweetie, this is so sad. Don't end this episode on stupid Michael the murderer. Boo, I hate you, michael.

Amanda: 11:03

And it was a good ending because, uh boo, I hate michael is how I felt at the end as well I mean that was the only good thing about him being an asshole at the end was it kind of took me out of the literal bawling I had been doing before that.

Theresa: 11:17

So I guess we owe them that yeah, because there's nothing like the murderer standing over a body with a small smirk on his face and it zooms in slowly Like what an actual asshole.

Amanda: 11:29

Yeah, he's a piece of shit, he's just standing over Ana Lucia's like body.

Kip: 11:34

Oh, I know.

Amanda: 11:35

Well, and I just yeah, Because you obviously ended on that kind of fuck you. Michael, note that I had to say something, but I mean, there's so many of those, this episode For someone who's barely in and, like you said, it's an echo episode.

Kip: 11:47

Yeah, and I think it's like it just speaks to how angry everyone is at Michael over it, because we don't even really really remember the echo stuff Cause even now we just watched it and we're still fixated on how shitty Michael is and how much we hate him.

Amanda: 12:03

I almost feel like it, like didn't do echo justice by like having it in the same episode, Cause it's like it. Yeah, it's going to be overshadowed. I think almost everything is overshadowed by that storyline.

Kip: 12:14

Yeah, I mean it makes sense in the next, in the next few episodes, but at the same time it really does feel like echo was almost like the b line in this one.

Amanda: 12:25

yeah, that was his episode, it was his flashback and like you said it is going to be important and like some, some really cool stuff happens some really cool little easter eggs happen in this episode too. It's a good episode.

Kip: 12:36

I, when I when you're driving over here, it's like I hate this episode, but don't no I actually like it, but I just it's tough, it is very hard it's a tough one, so so let's, let's. I feel like we need to talk about the echo stuff first yeah, because otherwise we will just not want to talk about it all the time.

Kip: 12:53

So what did you make of his flashbacks? Um, I didn't really realize at first. He was an australian here, right theresa, I felt the same thing, boy. He is not happy as a priest no, he looked really bored, he's. I loved his confession Be like you have to be penitent for your sins in order for it to work. Yeah, how many times did you cheat on her?

Amanda: 13:12

Okay, like he was kind of just like going through the motions, which I guess makes sense, because he doesn't really want to be there, right, and he's still doing whatever it is he's going to be doing.

Kip: 13:23

Yeah, which is a little confusing. I wasn't really sure what that guy was getting at, yeah, and I couldn't remember why he was in Australia. I think they talked about it in his last flashback episode.

Theresa: 13:37

Is that where the plane was going?

Kip: 13:39

No.

Theresa: 13:40

No.

Kip: 13:41

But like he came to Australia to be a priest, but I don't know why, I don't remember. Me neither, but anyway he wants to leave because he wants to go to LA. Yeah, so that was interesting.

Amanda: 13:55

Yeah, why does he want to go to the US?

Kip: 13:57

I don't think we know that either. I don't know if it's just like an escape because he's getting his fake passport Okay.

Amanda: 14:02

Hold on, guys. Why does he need a?

Kip: 14:03

fake passport. How did he get to Australia then?

Amanda: 14:06

Well, with that guy's help, I guess.

Kip: 14:08

Oh, maybe. Yeah, See, and I think again like I mean, this is a bit of this. Oh, it's a spoiler, but we know echo isn't on the show for all six seasons, but I think because he ended up leaving before they had wanted his whole story told, we're probably not getting all these things filled in as the storytellers would have wanted, because the actor who played echo left before they were sort of done with his story that makes sense so I I feel like maybe how we got in australia might've been more fleshed out for a future, or you know the next one I don't remember his next flashback and there's, there's, I know there's more so so we could still find that out.

Kip: 14:54

But yeah, it was definitely Australia. He didn't really seem to want to be there. He was the. What did you think of the miracle he was investigating?

Amanda: 15:05

Well, I mean, that's kind of funny, that it's the psychic from claire's. If people didn't pick up on that, that's that's what it is. It's the psychic from claire that claire went to see, and so it's kind of interesting. I don't know I that that was hard to listen to her coming back to life.

Theresa: 15:23

That was terrifying.

Kip: 15:23

That was horrifying. Yeah, that was.

Amanda: 15:26

I mean, the thing is like his explanation, like the psychic explanation about how she was really cold and had hypothermia and it was just like the like. I think that's legit, maybe, but then also all that stuff at the end where she's talking about how she talked to Yemi and like how she knows his name I don't know guys.

Kip: 15:43

Well, and it was a long time like that she was unconscious for, or?

Theresa: 15:49

it almost seemed like it was like 24 hours, it was like days later that they were going to perform like an autopsy.

Kip: 15:55

Like, if the guy, if the dad didn't think she was dead, was he just like oh, she's still just too cold. Like, is he not worried?

Amanda: 16:05

Like, like, I think, it's one of those things where, like, he believed she was dead until she wasn't right and then was like well then, the only explanation is that she wasn't. I mean, at the end of the day, like what?

Kip: 16:14

is a miracle.

Amanda: 16:14

Right, because, like at the end of the day, she was unconscious and presumed dead for how long? And is alive, like yeah whether or not it's like a church mandated miracle, it's so pretty cool absolutely.

Kip: 16:25

I find it funny how, like you kind of I don't know how realistic this is I'm imagining it's somewhat realistic how the church has to investigate these so-called miracles and like they have to send priests like detectives to try to figure out if it's like good enough to send to the vatican like they got to screen the miracles. Oh, that was kind of funny.

Amanda: 16:41

I think that is realistic, yeah but I.

Kip: 16:44

It was so funny how, when the psychic guy comes out and he's just like it's not true, my wife is just trying to get back at me because I'm a fraud and I'm a psychic, but I'm a fraud and I take advantage of people, and he's like, well, why would she want to do that? Because she's a zealot, like it's like so toxic, like what is this relationship? Why is this fraudulent? Because she's a zealot.

Amanda: 17:04

Like it's like, so toxic, Like. What is this relationship? Why is this fraudulent psychic married to a religious?

Kip: 17:08

zealot. And why is this religious zealot?

Amanda: 17:10

married to a fraudulent psychic.

Kip: 17:12

That's what I was saying.

Amanda: 17:13

Who are these people? Why are they so aware of their hatred for one another's professions and beliefs?

Kip: 17:20

Because if it's for the kid that daughter looks like she was 32 years old. I think they can let it go if they're doing it until she's of age.

Amanda: 17:28

Yeah, who knew?

Kip: 17:29

That was very strange.

Amanda: 17:31

But it's kind of funny because we're like kind of left in Claire's episode of the Psychic, Like you feel like he's a fraud. Then you feel like he might be real and you feel like he's a fraud. And then you kind of get this one later where you're like oh okay, so he must be a fraud, because he thinks he's a fraud and he kind of explains it away, but it's like still, is he a fraud?

Kip: 17:49

Right Because it opens up more questions. Because, like you said, teresa, does that mean the family was fake in LA, like the whole thing?

Amanda: 17:57

is just, yeah, like it's just. There's so many of these little like tidbits where people are connected and stuff. It's like insane, yeah. But yeah, I mean I don't believe in miracles the way that the vatican believes in them, so I don't think it was that type of miracle, but I do think it's pretty cool if you're dead for like 24 hours or presumed dead and you wake up and you're totally fine it'd be pretty traumatic if you woke up while someone's trying to cut into you oh yeah, yep, that would be pretty.

Kip: 18:23

Yeah, that's fucked up it was weird too, the interaction with the corner guy, like, yeah, it was a weird dynamic it was bad yeah, like he was like well, I went to middle school, I'm qualified to do this.

Amanda: 18:34

Well, and he said like didn't he say something online to like? He's like so this is what you do, or he's like well, yeah, it's my day job, yeah or something like that, and I was like why? Are you like? What do you mean?

Theresa: 18:44

it's not even me.

Amanda: 18:45

Yeah, like, like I guess maybe he just thought that he was like kind of questioning him because, like you know, I'm sure that guy's probably in some trouble because he's like an undertaker and a coroner.

Kip: 18:54

I was like okay, it was a weird. And then, like I had the captions on when I was watching it and when he puts the tape on, or subtitles or whatever, and like he puts the tape on to plan, it starts with like I'm here doing this autopsy with the beautiful Mrs So-and-so.

Amanda: 19:12

And she's like stop it. It's like what's going?

Theresa: 19:15

on. Why is there flirting? Yeah, he's a creep.

Amanda: 19:18

And then there's all this screaming all of a sudden, and I'm like which one is screaming the girl or the other girl.

Amanda: 19:33

Yeah, totally like strange. Yeah, it was weird. The yeah, the thought tracks were weird and I guess, like we're supposed to be that kind of left with the impression that, like he has. It's kind of similar to the john thing where, like you know, at a certain point you're like like when does john? You know, at a certain point you're like like when does john start going from? Kind of like pathetic loner. I don't believe in anything to this. Like ethereal, everything has purpose, like whatever echo's kind of like that in a different way, because like now he's so filled with that faith too right, and it's like, but when you leave them at the airport he's still like really reeling from that and doesn't really believe her, and then I guess it's all the stuff on the island that like just adds to his belief that she must have been right. And so we're seeing that like this is where he's come from and this is like where he's at.

Theresa: 20:21

I guess is that like the kind of the takeaway that's, that's how I figured, because I mean, I feel like the conversation with that girl is what fueled it, because he goes by a different last name. So there's no way that, like her, her psychic dad, who like does all this investigating, would be able to figure out that he's there on a fake name, figure out his real name, figure out that he's got this brother, whose name is also not that common Like so I think maybe on his flight over he was like had to have been true. And then with the plane and then the cross and his brother's kind of gummy body, I go ew Gross, it was kind of gummy body. Ew Gross. Well, it was kind of juicy, right.

Kip: 21:10

Oh, it was very dry Wasn't it still kind of like, wasn't it juicy?

Theresa: 21:14

It was kind of goopy, I think. It was Like wasn't it kind of shiny?

Amanda: 21:18

No, oh my God, I don't think so. His head was like peeling off it definitely wasn't that dry it was that dry. I don't know about that anyway. So his brother's gummy body gummy juicy body this is getting weirdly sexual. Wait, what I don't know, what you do, what are you saying, the way you're talking about it?

Theresa: 21:48

is is sexual to you, not me. You, I'm talking about a man who was deceased and I just thought that his body was still like kind of fleshy.

Amanda: 22:03

I don't want to talk about what his body may or may not be anymore.

Theresa: 22:05

You're the one who was like it was the way he was talking about it was weird. I wasn't like it was so gummy and juicy, anyway.

Amanda: 22:15

So his brother is dead and we think this. I mean we were saying like, all joking aside, that like when? Because now it's kind of going back to the what's going on with him. But that conversation he has with lock, where he's like explaining essentially like how they get to this point, it's like again, it's it's like we've talked about that with jack before, right that it's like, at a certain point, like what would it take for you to realize that something bigger is going on here? Because, like when he describes it, you're like yeah, that's pretty fucked exactly like I was literally in my notes.

Kip: 22:42

I'm like oh, echo's faith is really annoying me right now. And then after I'm like oh wait, that makes sense now. Yeah, after that speech how can you not just be like yeah, okay, there's something there.

Amanda: 22:51

So I guess, yeah, that is the takeaway, right, is that like? And I guess the difference kind of for John is like John never really needed that much to get to his point of faith, whereas like echo did, and now he's there and jack does, and it's still not enough, right, like it's just kind of like the different kind of ways people internalize like their circumstances, right, yeah, it's kind of neat so let's, let's talk then about, let's talk about lock first, because we're kind of on echo and they are obviously very close in this episode.

Kip: 23:28

Um, gimpy mccrutch, gimpy the crutch, okay, gets knocked out, or kind of he's just he is. You start the episode and you can tell he's just feeling like once he sees Anna Lucia and Libby he's just like kind of just done.

Kip: 23:51

Yeah, he's feeling that, I think, guilt, and he's like recognizing, like the, the ramifications of what's happened and, of course, as we see later in the episode, he's thinking of Boone. He's thinking of all these things and where his, his quote-unquote faith has led him and yeah, he's just in a bum place this episode he's not feeling good.

Amanda: 24:13

Well, it's funny that you because you said, lock and echo are very connected in this episode, but it's also kind of funny to me because it's like they are in so many different ways too, because it's actually showing how echo's letting his like own personal, like desires and faith and stuff get in the way because they do say they're gonna go look for michael and file, file um or henry sorry his name is michael emerson in real life.

Amanda: 24:36

Um, they're gonna go find fenry and then they just go off and do their own thing and it's like again, like if finding fenry was important, you've now fucked that for everyone right by like deciding to do this, whatever. So it felt very lock ish, because it felt very similar to when he kept being like I'm going hunting or I'm going to this, and they were going to the thing every day yeah, he's not very like john.

Amanda: 24:58

Deja vu vibes from that too. So like, definitely they're on a similar path, right, and then they go off together and it makes a lot of sense and yeah, locks I. I agree with you that he's like clearly like struggling and he's like and it is guilt to a degree, but I had a hard time with the guilt piece when he was talking about boone, because like he, he's like talking to Echo and he's like what happened here and he's like Like the plane fell and he's like how did it fall? Boone made it fall, then he died. He's like he died and it's like he was a sacrifice the island demanded or whatever, and it's like he didn't seem that guilty about it, though Like I kind of thought he was recognizing how like stupid he was to say something like that yeah, like yeah and how like he felt just because of me.

Kip: 25:56

This happened because I and and I said something so stupid after the fact, and now he's dead and like I can't believe, I actually thought that maybe it's not even guilt, maybe he's just feeling really dumb and embarrassed I got that a little bit more like then.

Amanda: 26:12

Not that he, I think he cares that boone died and I think he but I'm not sure guilt is really what he experiences yeah, I mean, I think there's maybe a little, but I think, talking about maybe it is more, just like this.

Kip: 26:26

He's embarrassed and he's just like feeling stupid and like it's less. It's again less about the other people and it's about him kind of feeling this way like oh man, I've I screwed up, but at the same time I'm more embarrassed for myself than I'm guilty about these other people who have been hurt agreed, I, I think that might be it a bit too, and like I don't think he's like a heartless person, like I don't think he.

Amanda: 26:50

I think he cares that everyone is dying, but I think at the end of the day, like a lot of times, he's able to justify it away, and I think you're right.

Kip: 26:58

I think now he's having a harder time being like well, and then like, even after they like we'll talk about the hatch a bit more too, but like he's embarrassed that, like all this has happened and now he's just like what a waste of time and even says like something like a waste of my pathetic life or something like that, so he's feeling sorry for himself, I think definitely yeah, he feels.

Amanda: 27:28

Yeah, he feels sorry. I think that's more what it is. He feels sorry for himself. Yeah, right, and I think he's thinking like I did.

Amanda: 27:36

All I like this was finally what I was meant to be doing and finally, I was a part of something important and it's like everywhere he turns it's falling apart, yeah, and like yeah, I don't know. So it's nice to see him kind of come back around towards the end a bit, but again, it's, it's funny how, like what you take away from it and like talking it out, because he struggles so much with like believing in stuff, even though, like that seems to be what we associate the most with him. This is like deep-seated belief in faith. He actually struggles a lot with his faith, which makes that whole like it's never been easy, like quote with john or with jack even more interesting, because, like log, it's not linear for lock right, like echo has to basically talk him back into it right and so you know, you see, that lock's faith can actually be shaken pretty and it doesn't even really succeed Because Locke's not.

Kip: 28:34

He got a little bit excited when they found the hatch door. Definitely, and he was kind of like oh, cool mystery again, I want to get in on this. But then after they saw everything, I think he just was. I don't even think he was sort of humoring Echo at the end. I don't think he really believes anything again, I think he's still feeling pretty shitty about it all I do uh like.

Amanda: 28:54

So what do you like? What did you guys think when you first saw the hatch, the new hatch, we call it hatch 2.0 that's 2.0, pearl the pearl.

Kip: 29:02

Technically it's three, because we found the medical hatch too. Oh, yeah, they love hatches oh, they gotta have a hatch.

Amanda: 29:07

The dharma initiative. Slash others, slash who the fuck knows who's doing all this stuff yeah, and they really like to put them underground yeah hidden, secret, full of secrets.

Kip: 29:16

Yeah, secret secrets, secret secrets hurt somebody secret.

Amanda: 29:26

Oh shit, I can't remember wait what is this I'm gonna find it I've literally never heard this before I thought you were going the route of like hurt people, hurt people.

Kip: 29:34

No, Secrets, secrets.

Amanda: 29:36

Secret people.

Kip: 29:38

It's such a good saying and you're going to.

Amanda: 29:41

We're going to be so excited I hope you can find it.

Kip: 29:44

Oh, I can find it. It's right here. Secret secrets are no fun. Secret secrets hurt someone.

Amanda: 29:54

Oh.

Kip: 29:55

Said by Stripper from the Office. Oh why Michael's most favorite advice.

Amanda: 30:02

Right right.

Theresa: 30:03

And he says thank you, stripper Right.

Amanda: 30:06

Thank you, stripper Anyway secrets.

Kip: 30:10

They love their secrets.

Amanda: 30:11

They do, they do. So they come across this hatch and we go in and we see that it looks brainwashy yeah yeah super brainwashy.

Theresa: 30:23

Doesn't that remind you of those like shows where there's someone like strapped to a chair?

Amanda: 30:27

and they've got like 10,000 yeah, like clockwork, monitors, stuff, yeah totally. So then they put in another orientation video and we see another iteration of the same Guy with a different name, guy with a different name.

Kip: 30:42

VHS tape which so weird, oh, I was like. Oh, I feel so nostalgic now for like the tracking buttons on VCR. You've got to track. You have to do the tracking. Yeah, yeah buttons on vcr. You gotta track, you have to do the tracking. Yeah, yeah, like when? When were these from?

Amanda: 30:55

1980 is the name, is it?

Kip: 30:58

I don't know, I guess vcrs were around then. I thought they were more like a mid 80s, late 80s thing into the 90s, but I don't know. I don't know that very well, to be honest when did the? Beta. It wasn't a beta max what's a beta max? Oh, theresa beta max is like the other vhs but like it was bigger I think it came back in 1956.

Amanda: 31:23

Uh, vcr, yeah, however jesus it was much different than later types, but most people think because it was made for television networks and cost $50,000, which is around $325. Yeah, late 1970s.

Kip: 31:36

Oh, okay, well, there we go, perfect timing.

Amanda: 31:38

Yeah.

Theresa: 31:39

As usual, to early 2000s they do their research.

Kip: 31:42

To the early 2000s.

Amanda: 31:43

Essentially, from late 1970s to early 2000s, essentially every home had a VCR and a mountain of tapes to accompany it.

Kip: 31:49

Oh yeah.

Theresa: 31:53

I had one of those um where the tv and the vcr were like attached.

Kip: 31:55

Oh, combo yeah oh yeah, I had one too and like the blank tapes you could buy they all have those like designs. You could like pull the tab to not record over it if you wanted.

Theresa: 32:03

You know how like I didn't know you could do that you could take that tab off and then you couldn't record over it people always recorded over my shit but if you took the tab off, you could put a strip of tape over it.

Amanda: 32:14

If you still wanted to record, you could hack it where were you when I was growing up, argyle gosh darn it with a lot of time on his hands taping things also fun fact. First vcr, that was like manufactured to the homes were in the 1970s, 1975. Obviously it cost one thousand four hundred dollars oh my god and then by the mid 90s they're like two hundred dollars, two hundred four hundred dollars.

Amanda: 32:39

You get a really good one I remember like they got pretty fancy looking mid late 90s we had a really nice one in our living room and then the shittier one got moved to my bedroom and I remember the new one was super like, the buttons were nice and, yeah, you could. I used to do this trick where I would record things off the tv, but then what you did on the commercials, you would pause the recording yeah and then unpause it when the commercial ended.

Kip: 33:07

And then you've made your own commercial free recording I remember doing that too, and it was so cool.

Amanda: 33:12

This is so cool, and then every once in a while like because I used to record xena and hercules and then sometimes we would leave it to record on a timer- oh, that was fancy, that's super fancy.

Kip: 33:23

Oh yeah, but then you couldn't do that. So then every once in a while I'd have one that I had to do that for, and then I had to fast forward the commercials yeah, exactly, although now I know the odd time we'll watch, like we had taken some vhs's that were recorded back in the day and like digitized them. This was quite a few years ago and like you see the commercials from like the early 90s I know it's so it's the best part.

Amanda: 33:44

Oh my god, so good, I know. Now I'm like sad.

Kip: 33:47

I cut them all out I know, but at the time it was amazing yeah, oh, anyway man, what a stroll down memory lane.

Amanda: 33:54

Anyway. So they have a VHS. Probably cost about $1,000 for them to make those at the time in 1980.

Kip: 34:01

Dharmanish had deep pockets.

Amanda: 34:03

Oh yeah, and yeah, he alludes, and that's what it is.

Kip: 34:07

It's an illusion. Exactly, it's not a full-blown statement.

Amanda: 34:13

No. So what he says is you don't need to know what they think they're doing, you just need to know they think it's something important. He never once says it isn't.

Kip: 34:20

No.

Amanda: 34:20

And he never says it is. He does allude that it's like kind of crap.

Kip: 34:24

Because he does say something along lines of psychological experiment or something. And Locke just eats it up. Yeah, you know, like you said, teresa, with what Fenry said last week or the week before, whatever, and again, john shouldn't be trusting him. He's done nothing but lie since he got in there. But he does because Locke or Fenry gave him a little bit of attention and now this is just like icing on the cake for him. He's done. Just. I agree with you.

Theresa: 34:51

Said that when he was watching and just to look on his face like he is devastated, yeah it was amazing acting oh, phenomenal, it was so good you can see the moment where he's like processing that, like he sees jack in the kitchen yeah, oh yeah and I'm like, well, that's upsetting, but also like a little weird Totally. Let's turn that monitor off.

Amanda: 35:14

He's just such a weird guy because, like he struggles so much but then also has no problem just putting his paper in that, by the way, nostalgia for sending cash drops from the office to the office.

Kip: 35:29

Oh, I never did that, but I remember it from Costco.

Theresa: 35:32

Seeing them do the things at costco. They do it at costco they used to.

Amanda: 35:35

They don't anymore, but same thing it was like how they would get rid of like big drops of cash so they didn't have them in the till because costco think about the bills people drop at costco back when they only took cash right they only took cash.

Kip: 35:48

There's a while there, well there's a place where everyone almost maybe a check here and there they used to, but yeah, like it was just every till had those pneumatic tubes and oh, that was very nostalgic. I loved I know I loved it too gets rid of his map like I don't fucking care anymore I mean, that map was very makeshift.

Amanda: 36:07

The fact that they got as far as they did is honestly when I was like your map is inexact and he's like, oh really, yeah, obviously.

Theresa: 36:18

That's a nice way to put it. Or when he's like, is this a river? And he's like it's a squiggly line, yeah, he was really down this episode.

Amanda: 36:28

He's such an Eeyore in this episode.

Theresa: 36:29

He didn't even feel like himself. He felt like a whole different person for the bulk of this episode.

Amanda: 36:35

He was rough.

Kip: 36:37

He was definitely in a valley and he says it's not my hatch anymore. Okay, that was. We were annoyed at him for saying it was his hatch.

Theresa: 36:50

No, it's not his hatch.

Kip: 36:51

It's like, oh John, just get over it. His hatch? No, it's not his hatch. It's like, oh, john, just get over it yeah, it's still your hatch.

Theresa: 36:55

You still got shit to do. Yeah, jesus also, do you have anything better to do than push?

Amanda: 37:00

I was gonna say just a job at a certain point, you know, in two months yeah, like just push the damn thing, like like you have a hatch full of hot water food, I will say that printout made me so excited for the next couple episodes oh yeah, I thought you were gonna say um, because another nostalgia was hearing a dot matrix printer oh yeah, remember the printers where you had to rip off the like edges used to make banners with those.

Kip: 37:31

Oh, I loved doing that, yeah oh man that was a good one that's not a good dot matrix that was very nostalgic, for sure, but yes, I agree for the next few episodes.

Amanda: 37:41

Holy shit yeah oh, oh, I do not, as per usual but like there's some good stuff coming, but it's fun because it makes it feel like you're watching for the first time and then when she'll be watching, she's like oh, yeah, yeah, and you're like, yeah, yeah, there she is that's great there it is, but even when you, when you saw annalise and libya get shot, you had no remembrance of that I knew what happened at zumbot.

Theresa: 38:09

I didn't know what happened now and I didn't know that it happened together.

Amanda: 38:13

Yeah well and let's talk about that, because I did not remember that libby made it through the whole second, this whole episode yeah, um, okay, how do we want to handle this?

Kip: 38:24

like, there's a few things, there's the jack and sawyer and Kate stuff.

Amanda: 38:32

Yeah.

Kip: 38:33

Which is pretty simple, Like I mean, that's pretty standard.

Amanda: 38:35

Jack again, though, is being kind of an asshole in this episode.

Kip: 38:38

Really, I don't think so.

Amanda: 38:39

I don't really like, I don't like. Even Kate at one point is like stop, Jack Right.

Kip: 38:48

Like to lock. She was saying that to both of them, though.

Amanda: 38:49

Oh well, Sawyer is expected, though. Saw to both of them though. Oh yeah, well swear it's expected though.

Amanda: 38:54

Well, he's gonna be an asshole that's kind of his mo, yeah, but I mean, but like you know he's I'm not really sure like yeah, lock shouldn't have lied and kind of I guess he kind of jumped in front of annalicia from saying it or whatever, but I'm not sure. Like the the next step in that is this is all your fault. And like, at the end of the day, anna Lucia also could have said something like I don't think Locke could have known like Sawyer's kind of like so sorry, being a dick too. Like I don't think Sawyer could have like sorry, kind of implied that like we should have all known this was going to happen and it's like I'm not sure that we a could have foreseen that Anna Lucia would go after him which, by the way, it's not exactly what happened anyway. Yeah, or even if she did that, like it's up to lock to be the like she's an, like it kind of pisses me off when people talk about stuff like that. So, at the end of the day, like Ana Lucia could have been like, uh, I don't know what you're talking about. Lock, like I didn't slip. Yeah, exactly, fenry fucking attacked me, you asshole.

Amanda: 39:55

And also she could have still, despite that being like not done what everyone thinks she did, like she's still a person. And it almost pisses me off when people like take away especially women's like autonomy. In situations like that, it's like, yeah, like lock did lie and like she went along with it, but like that was still her choice to a degree, like she had the ability to stop. Let's not all talk about how like lock is the big reason this all happened, because like that's not what happened. And also like she's a person and like she makes choices. You know, like and it's done. Like I've never understood the whole, like well, you should have been. And then even swear, kind of like getting on board with us, like shut up, swear, like you're not, you weren't even a part of any of this. Like if we really want to get, whose fault this?

Amanda: 40:33

is like who let their dick get in the way of like the gun being taken right like this. I hate that whole like pile on like it's everyone else's fault and I get that in this situation, like that's what people do, but it was just kind of frustrating. It's like who cares at this point, like it is what it is, there's no point, and I kind of liked kate in that when kate was just kind of like yeah same you know like everyone shut up like this is not what matters right now exactly

Amanda: 40:57

let's get let's get to it I liked kate a lot in this episode yeah, she was good.

Kip: 41:02

Um, jack I thought was standard issue jack like just especially when they got to the hatch, like he was in crisis mode and doing what, what he could, what he thought he had to do. Um, I think all of them are just like we're all like along with us. We're just kind of in shock at the situation and so obviously, like you know, tempers flare and and people go a little off off kilter.

Amanda: 41:28

But um, I also think, just shock though that he can't manipulate sawyer into showing him where the guns well, that was smart that was smart. I agree, that's what I'm saying. He still has his, no, exactly his wits?

Amanda: 41:43

yeah, exactly, but I mean, I think they're also reeling into terms of just like the body counts piling up again like yeah it with more death and and I think like I don't know, I can't say for sure what obviously these fictitious characters are thinking, but I would. I would personally be like, okay, when I landed on a, crashed on an island, I expected some level of death and destruction, starvation maybe, some cliff falls, maybe some animal attacks, a lot less gun action than I was like yep, so like I think there's a part two that's like jack's like maybe, if you can't articulate it.

Amanda: 42:24

It's like how is so much of this violence or this death at the hands of violence from other people?

Kip: 42:33

exactly scary.

Amanda: 42:34

It is scary, yeah, totally a hundred percent, because that is not what you would be expecting, and that's why, when he's like I don't have what I need, it's like, of course you don't. Yeah, even if you like could have you know, predicted that you would need something, it wouldn't be this kind of stuff like you would think, it would be starvation like cuts bruises yeah like it wouldn't be the third.

Kip: 43:00

Like bullet wound that you've holy shit.

Amanda: 43:03

No kidding like death by bullet wound too. By the way, not just not taking into account sawyer. Count Sawyer being shot and you know like it's just.

Kip: 43:12

It's a lot of violence, yeah yeah, way too much yeah, no, and it was funny when um Sawyer and Kate go back to get the heroin and everything and she's just questioning him and all this stuff and he's like, do you have to make everything so difficult? And I laugh because I'm like that could be said for every single one of these characters. Yeah, by the way, that they withhold information and then talk about other things and it's like everyone makes everything so much more complicated than it has to be. I mean obviously, yeah, we want that conflict yeah, we need that drama yeah I did.

Amanda: 43:47

really I liked sawyer and kate a lot in this, so like, so I was also I being a bit of an asshole, but I think he was just piling on to kind of get the heat off of him a bit, and I think whenever he has an opportunity to do that, he does, but I really liked that whole like. I feel like Sawyer's a very well-written character every time, with the exception of the attacking son. I feel like most of what sawyer does is very consistent with the character they've created for him. Like, even like if you had to tell me, like, if someone was like he's gonna have the heroin, like will he give it, even if it's gonna fuck him over in the way, I would have been like absolutely he will right, because, like I just feel like that's who he is, like he wouldn't let, like he said he's like's, like he knows I'm not going to let Libby suffer, like I think Jack knows that, because we all know that, because that's very true to like who he is.

Amanda: 44:43

And I think he's like very well fleshed out in that way and even like at the end, when Kate's like crying and he like holds her, like that's very Sawyer esque to me, like I feel like he's really like it's just. I think he's a really good example in this episode of how, like he's not the star of it, he's not like whatever, but most decisions that he makes, and even like Jack and even like most of them, really are like very consistent with like the characters that they've spent the last almost two seasons developing.

Kip: 45:12

Yeah, I would with like the characters that they've spent the last almost two seasons developing. Yeah, I would say all of them are very consistent in this episode. I agree, I don't. I don't think like I mean sawyer too, but I think all of them are.

Kip: 45:22

And I mean we got a damon in a carlton yeah at written episode, right, so like they're that does make sense they're gonna be right on top of all that stuff, but um, but they do go back to the tent and that's where they find her lee asking if they'd seen libby I know I completely forgot that, holy shit he would have been waiting all night I don't think it was all night

Kip: 45:42

well, that's the thing. It was a weird episode in terms of night and day, like it had to be because they were walking at night.

Amanda: 45:49

Yeah and when they found michael yeah that's, that's why oh was like the sun coming up when they go to Sawyer's cabin or tent.

Kip: 45:59

Then but that's what I don't know, because in then in last week's episode they they approach Sawyer and it's still light out, and then they're like let's go because Jack, or because uh well, jesus Christ, because Locke says I have to tell you something about Aunt Lucia, and it's still daylight. And then in this episode they're walking and it's nighttime, yeah, and then they go back to Sawyer's tent after and it's daytime again. Like the whole night and day thing was a little wacky in this episode.

Theresa: 46:27

I felt like yeah, like I can't really tell how far anything is. No, because they kind of seem like he's like give me 20 minutes, so it would take him 20 minutes to get from the hatch to his tent and back. So then, why is it nighttime? Yeah, where were they walking? How long did they fight before they decided to leave? Like many questions, yeah.

Kip: 46:51

Well, I don't know, it's just again like in shows like this, where the time is a matter of convenience. Yeah, you know like if they need to spend an episode walking to the hatch because they need to have all this like dialogue and conversation and everything, it's going to take a whole episode.

Theresa: 47:07

Mm-hmm.

Kip: 47:07

But in this, where they need it right away, it takes them like a split second.

Theresa: 47:10

Like ten minutes.

Kip: 47:11

But yeah, it's nighttime, right?

Amanda: 47:13

Yeah, yeah, it's nighttime right, yeah, it makes no sense. So this is my new theory. In this last 10 seconds of Okay, it starts to look like it's light out, here, though I'm very confused.

Kip: 47:24

Yeah, it's confusing.

Amanda: 47:26

Because then what I was going to say was I think that they are coming back at night and then we get like a night kind of time of them dealing with Libby and stuff, but then like you can see here, that it like looks kind of like light when you like look out the window of the hatch.

Theresa: 47:44

But that's a fake light. The hatch is underground.

Amanda: 47:46

Oh right, can we cut that? No, leave it in. Leave it in, it has to stay in. Oh, okay, so then that back to my original theory. Uh, they spend the night trying to fix libby, and then, you're right. That means then, poor harley's been the whole night being like uh, have you seen libby? And then I really liked the cut away that they don't.

Kip: 48:10

We don't actually see what like what kate says and you just kind of see his body droop like with the weight of the oh.

Amanda: 48:19

And then you see my body droop with the weight of tears coming down my face.

Kip: 48:24

Well, and then just like holy shit when they're back in the hatch and he's like I was. I forgot to get the blankets, or or, oh no, he's saying to michael I know we were gonna be on our first date and michael's like what?

Amanda: 48:39

date. He's like I'm glad you're okay, man, and I was like oh he said that I just and then like this is how you know, michael is a villain like a true like villain, era villain like how can you listen to that? Yeah, I know and be like I'm glad you're okay, man, and like not be like have any sort of like Literally zero. If even if he had like some sort of emotional reaction, that like Hurley, then chalked up to like just emotion about something else, I could almost be like okay.

Amanda: 49:06

Maybe there's something but zero, but he has zero emotion and he just like, he keeps being like, oh, did you say anything? Cause he doesn't give a shit. He doesn't give a shit, he just doesn't want to get caught. Exactly like when he you can see on his face when she first wakes up oh yeah, she's like oh shit, yeah, I'm fucked. Yeah, like in no way. There's not even like a minute of relief. Like, oh my god, one of the people I almost killed, made it exactly like it was like not even a split second of that.

Amanda: 49:30

It was like the whole thing was like oh shit, oh shit, oh shit, oh shit.

Kip: 49:33

Did she say anything like? And then, like they're trying to make it seem they think that he like cares about her. Yeah, and he's just no I hope she's fucking dying, like I hope she's dead that's what's really fucked up is that he hopes that she's fucking dying.

Theresa: 49:46

Yeah exactly.

Amanda: 49:47

And he's like excited when they like say all I can do is make her comfortable and drug her up so gross.

Theresa: 49:53

Yeah, he's awful, awful literally what I've been saying since day one yes, you're like, I don't hate him I don't hate him. What the hell I do I?

Amanda: 50:03

hate him now. I hate him, I mean, I forgot that he had done these things. So now it's full-on hate, but I was never on board with michael I know he has bad energy, he's bad vibes I mean, I don't think

Amanda: 50:16

anyone could have anticipated this, but it's just, it's so. Like I said, when Harley's like I'm glad you're okay, man, I'm like Nope, I'm not. Anything, any sort of flash of recognition of the fact that you are going straight to hell now, anything, but in his mind that's. The thing, though, is I don't think he actually feels it, because he's just like he's gotta get to wall gotta get to wall, gotta get to wall, gotta get to wall, gotta do whatever I can to get to walt.

Theresa: 50:42

And it's like if I found out that buddy that my dad killed two people to save me. I would never be able to look him in the face ever again.

Amanda: 50:51

Like I would not be able to talk to that man I think the difference, though, is that, like I think he'd, he'd I think some dads parents would still maybe do those things to their kids and then here, that'd be like if, like, say, your dad did something like that and then you were like dad, I can never forgive you. I think there's some dads out there that'd be like that's fine, I don't expect you to ever forgive me, I don't care.

Kip: 51:14

All I wanted was for you to be okay. I did what I had to do.

Amanda: 51:16

I accept that that means that my life is over. I accept the fact that it means you probably hate me, but doesn't change the fact that I would do that anything for my kid. The vibe I get from michael is that if he were to say to walt like what I can imagine is 20 years from now when michael's in like an old folks home and he's like you, you don't visit me enough, and Walt's like sorry, dad, I'm busy, and he's like I killed two people for you?

Kip: 51:39

Yeah, exactly.

Amanda: 51:41

That's the energy that Michael gives off. And that is part of the reason why I hate him? Yeah, because, like, there's no way you know he's going to like Michael's going to be like I really want ice cream for dinner and Michael's going people for you, but we don't always get what we want, walt and then, throw his comic book in a fire. Yeah, exactly what an asshole.

Kip: 52:02

Oh, and all that tracks, and all that tracks oh, yeah, yeah it was, it was a tough episode like very good in the sense that it made us feel all these feels, but like yeah, it was a tough episode, not gonna lie well, we didn't even talk about the last little bit, which is just fucking hard like when he starts injecting her with the heroin and then it's just oh, and she says I just started literally bawling and sobbing yeah, I'm the same and then with her to wake up and kind of say, and it was the same thing like from beginning down.

Amanda: 52:28

This was a another kind of like pulse pounding episode, because the spit in sawyer's face of the blood at the beginning to her like crying out in fear with Michael's name and the look on her face when she died horrifying.

Kip: 52:41

It's so sad.

Amanda: 52:42

Horrifying, so sad that's what I was hoping like. It makes total sense that she'd be like Michael and Jack would assume like, and that even it's like, oh, like, he's okay, he made it. It's like I. Literally you're not even in this scene.

Theresa: 52:58

Minus a hundred.

Kip: 52:59

And I hate you. So many minus points, minus a hundred, just because she said just because he was like, don't worry.

Amanda: 53:06

And then to like be so. And then they're just chalking it up to her being concerned about Michael and just being afraid of death.

Kip: 53:11

And I just felt so bad for Hurley in that moment too, because it's like this final moments, and of course, like you know, they're all thinking that she's just concerned about Michael, but like he couldn't, even her final, his final moments with her was her being in this horrified state and and they don't understand why, no, it's so sad.

Amanda: 53:31

And then he just apologizing for forgetting that. Oh Jesus.

Theresa: 53:34

The blankets. It's so upsetting Of all the characters to hurt. I know Hurley.

Kip: 53:38

You cannot hurt Hurley.

Theresa: 53:39

Sweet, sweet Hurley, oh my God.

Amanda: 53:41

You know, like it just yeah, his bawling was just oh and then him crying.

Amanda: 53:47

I was sobbing and then they cut to Kate crying and like just the fact, like, and that like kate didn't know her as well, or whatever, but I think it's just the weight of what's going on is just weighing so heavy on these people and it's like you know, especially like kate's very tough, so it's very tough, jack's very tough, but it's like you can see it's weighing on all of them so much in different ways, like this cannot be easy for jack. The amount of people, as a doctor, he's had to just like essentially watch die or assist to die exactly.

Kip: 54:20

Well, that whole time they're in there, can you imagine the tension? And then like when, when libby does finally pass away, you just feel that tension finally lift and they can all just sort of like let it out just start crying and just be like holy shit, like this has been horrible, so bad.

Kip: 54:40

That final scene of the camera panning in on Michael with Libby or not Libby Anna Lucie lying there on that cot and he just like doesn't give a shit, no, it almost looks like he's it almost looks like he's like smirking Like I got away with it, fuck, yeah. Yeah, I like smirking like I got away with it. Fuck yeah. Yeah, I didn't see a smirk, but I definitely sensed that that vibe that like yeah relief like okay, she's dead, she's dead.

Amanda: 55:05

Everyone believed that I got shot. Everyone's mad at fenry. The computer's beeping away.

Kip: 55:10

We're good to go. Yeah, yeah, that ending with the computer beeping and everything. Jesus the tension. Yeah, it was a heavy episode.

Theresa: 55:17

They build tension very well on this show, they do All right.

Kip: 55:21

So I don't know. To me, I think we covered it all.

Theresa: 55:23

I think that's literally everything. Let's try and watch it.

Kip: 55:27

Yeah, it's time for the rankings. I'm curious how many more am I going to get?

Theresa: 55:35

We'll start from the top. All right, Number one. We have Hurley with 1905. Then we have Sun with 1630. Saeed with 1555. Locke with 1545. Rounding out the top five, we have Echo with 1470. Then we have Jin with 1250. Sawyer with 925. Claire with 780, Jack with 650, and Libby's very last time on the rankings list she's at number 10 with 480. Walt has 240. Desmond has 60. Kate has 75. Charlie has negative 660. And Michael is at the bottom with negative 4265 sorry, can we please?

Amanda: 56:21

I know I've said this last week, but I'm serious. I know you usually take people out once they leave and, spoiler alert, michael eventually leaves. Thank the lord. Um, can we keep him, just to see? I just want it's like almost like a like guide post for like, how far like no one has ever how far you could fall, like no one will ever be that like low ever, like I can't think of anybody the fact that there are only two people in the negatives

Amanda: 56:48

yeah and one of them is negative 660 and one is a negative 4000. I think really speaks to how we feel about those two characters.

Theresa: 56:58

Michael was barely in the episode and he dropped 400 points because every time the.

Kip: 57:04

The was barely in that episode, but his presence was felt throughout the entire thing. Like I said, if I had been doing rankings.

Amanda: 57:11

I would have done the exact same thing when he she's like michael and then dies.

Kip: 57:13

I'd be like minus two million points, michael, yeah if amanda was doing the rankings, we'd be in the billions it'd be even worse. It'd be so arbitrary, yeah all right, okay, so my top obviously your top was michael no, michael's at the bottom and I'm pretty sure jack's at the top. That's fair I have a very different rankings than Teresa. Well, no Michael's at the bottom, but Michael's always at the bottom. Yeah, he's surpassed.

Amanda: 57:41

Jack is our like steady, like calm in the storm port in the storm kind of thing, like he does keep his shit together for the most part.

Kip: 57:49

Yeah, he's very middle of the road for Teresa, which I guess makes sense because he's sort of like Most main characters are.

Amanda: 57:55

Most main characters are not people's favorites right. Jack's top and Michael's bottom.

Kip: 58:04

That's fair.

Amanda: 58:05

All right.

Kip: 58:09

We just need to chill for a second.

Amanda: 58:11

Just enjoy this calming music.

Theresa: 58:15

Gummy. Deep breaths Juicy Gummy, deep breaths.

Kip: 58:18

Juicy Gummy. Juicy Gummy.

Theresa: 58:20

I said relax not be disgusted Gummy.

Kip: 58:23

Juicy, and now there's a remix happening.

Theresa: 58:28

Teresa, you begin. Okay, mine's an eight Point two.

Kip: 58:34

Just stack on a point two.

Theresa: 58:36

Mine's an eight point two. Point two it was a good episode, not my favorite episode. A lot of tension, a lot of negative feelings for Michael, a lot of kind of like you feel kind of bad for Locke. But it's a Echo episode. Everybody knows I love echo. A lot of our echoes, arms, um hence the point to so, uh yeah, 8.2 from good old t-dog all right.

Kip: 59:11

Uh, this is a tough one for me. I don't know, I really don't. I haven't thought about it. I think, like I think it is an Echo episode, but I find that I don't really think about Echo when I'm thinking of the episode. So I think that's sort of like not a great thing, A bit of a negative thing. So I think I'm going to have to give it like a 7.8. Like it was really good, like the acting was great, the characters were consistent and good and the story was good. Okay, I'm gonna give it an 8.5.

Amanda: 59:46

Like screw that thing, it's a really good episode.

Kip: 59:50

Yeah, why would I give it low? Now 8.5. Talk myself.

Amanda: 59:54

I'm going to try to only give them to the haves going forward, so I'm going to give this an 8.5 as well. Similarly, when Kip was going through about how good it all was, I felt similarly about it, so it seems weird to go below that. I agree, like it's one of those episodes where, like it's such a good episode, but it's like such a hard episode, so it's not like I'm like oh my God, I can't wait to watch question mark every time it comes around.

Amanda: 1:00:23

But there's, the elements of it are so pure and so good and like I, I really like I have always loved the like lock going through an existential crisis type moments and I again through an existential crisis type moments and again we're getting like there's such an emotional weight to these episodes but there is still like a through line, yeah, for what's coming and it's very well done.

Amanda: 1:00:48

The show is well written yeah, it's like so, it sounds so, like just not sufficient to be like it's so well written, like there needs to be more to say about it. But the idea that we can have these emotionally resonating episodes, but like still they're driving the story forward, it's like phenomenal storytelling that just I don't know that anyone can do better than Carlton Hughes and Damon Lindelof, to be honest.

Kip: 1:01:05

Teresa, why don't you close us out?

Theresa: 1:01:07

All right. So thanks for listening in with us and talking about Question Mark with your Oceanic Three Tune in next time. Wherever you get your podcasts to our next episode, feel free to follow us on any of our socials at letsgetlostpod, and feel free to check out our Patreon, where, for as little as $3 a month, you can get access to things like Spoiler Island and our bloopers and fun stuff. All right, bye.