Amanda:
[00:00:00 - 00:00:01]
We got the yips. 

Kip:
[00:00:01 - 00:00:02]
Okay. We got the giggles. 

Theresa:
[00:00:02 - 00:00:03]
Hold on. 

Kip:
[00:00:03 - 00:00:32]
Welcome. Welcome to the season three finale of let's Get Lost. And we. We're a little giggly. We're a little excited, we're a little sad, but we just watched the episodes together. We. We don't ever do that except for the big ones, like the finales and the premieres. So we're all just a little excited. We're ready to grok, we're ready to record, we're ready to talk about it. We're just ready to get right into it. But, I mean, like, this is huge, guys. 

Amanda:
[00:00:32 - 00:00:49]
Yeah. Like, this is literally, like, we're 30 minutes out from all the emotions that comes with something as big as this. Season three is arguably the biggest end to a season other than the finale. So it's. It's. It's pretty important. 

Theresa:
[00:00:50 - 00:00:51]
It's big, it's huge. 

Amanda:
[00:00:51 - 00:00:52]
It's huge. 

Theresa:
[00:00:52 - 00:00:52]
It's large. 

Amanda:
[00:00:53 - 00:01:16]
So we decided that we're going to record them together for those kind of following along. It's very likely that however you're ingesting it this time around, albeit streaming or the DVDs, it might have it. It there. They were aired as two parts, like, I think one week apart. 

Kip:
[00:01:16 - 00:01:17]
No, Same night. 

Amanda:
[00:01:17 - 00:01:18]
Same night. 

Kip:
[00:01:18 - 00:01:19]
Okay, so they would have aired them. 

Amanda:
[00:01:19 - 00:01:21]
Okay, so this is how God intended it. 

Kip:
[00:01:21 - 00:01:21]
Yes. 

Amanda:
[00:01:22 - 00:01:54]
And so we're gonna give you the synopsis for both. There is technically a synopsis for both, but I'm just gonna kind of let you know overall what happens. It's probably gonna give you a pretty big idea of the whole scenario. Part one and part two of through the Looking Glass, which is such an iconic title that really resonates with fans. So through the Looking Glass was written by Carlton Cuse and Damon Lindelof and directed by Jack Bender, because they always bring out the big guns on these finales. 

Kip:
[00:01:55 - 00:01:55]
Always. 

Amanda:
[00:01:56 - 00:02:31]
Part one, Jack and his fellow castaways begin their efforts to make contact with Naomi's rescue ship. JYN Said and Bernard set a trap that could cost them their lives. Desmond goes searching for Charlie, and the others begin to question Ben's leadership. Off the island, A distraught Jack considers ending it all. Part two, we catch up with them as the castaway pays the ultimate price in the struggle against the others. Hurley goes on a mission to save his friends. Jack must make the call that decides the fate of the rescue operation. Off the island, we get a glimpse into Jack's life. 

Kip:
[00:02:31 - 00:02:33]
Oh, that's very vague. 

Amanda:
[00:02:33 - 00:02:41]
I love how detailed everything is for the on island. But then off Island. It's. But if you're given an impossible task. 

Kip:
[00:02:42 - 00:02:57]
Totally. And yeah, I, I agree that like this is one episode. I think they fully intended it to be one, but they were probably stuck with network constrictions where it still had to be a 42 minute episode. 

Amanda:
[00:02:57 - 00:03:12]
Well, they probably because you know, it's literally been so long since I watched network television. But they always have that big, you know, they have ad breaks and then there's a big chunk of ad breaks at the end of an episode before the start of the next program, top of the hour. So. So I would imagine they probably wanted to keep that. 

Kip:
[00:03:12 - 00:03:21]
Totally. And it was always like it's always with especially losses like a two part season finale. Like they love that if it. 

Amanda:
[00:03:21 - 00:03:23]
Watch them together if you're going to watch them. 

Kip:
[00:03:23 - 00:03:29]
And like if it was streaming, it would just be one extra long episode as how they do it nowadays. So. 

Amanda:
[00:03:30 - 00:03:48]
So that to me is the funniest part about streaming. Not to go completely off topic, but like, you know, when you're watching Lost, we go to. We're getting a 41 to 43 minute episode. That's what's happening. Then you watch Wheel of Time and it's like 43 minutes, 51 minutes an hour and six minutes. It's like they just do whatever they need to do. 

Kip:
[00:03:48 - 00:03:50]
Yeah. To tell that story. 

Amanda:
[00:03:50 - 00:03:50]
So interesting. 

Kip:
[00:03:50 - 00:04:00]
But there was so. There's so much more constrictions with network televisions. Like you, you, you have to have it in that time frame. You have to have certain rules. Like it's so bizarre. 

Amanda:
[00:04:00 - 00:04:05]
You have to build in like acts. Right. Like, so that they can have ad breaks. 

Kip:
[00:04:05 - 00:04:07]
Exactly. You know when those commercial breaks are going to hit. 

Amanda:
[00:04:08 - 00:04:15]
That's crazy. So. But okay, this is a tough one and I. Teresa, your stream of consciousness just for all the whole thing. 

Kip:
[00:04:15 - 00:04:18]
Okay, wait, I have to tell you some quick facts about this episode. 

Amanda:
[00:04:18 - 00:04:19]
Sorry, I'm getting. 

Kip:
[00:04:19 - 00:04:20]
I know. 

Amanda:
[00:04:20 - 00:04:22]
So excited. I'm just like, let's hear about the episode. 

Kip:
[00:04:22 - 00:04:26]
So because it's two episodes, there's two IMDb ratings. 

Theresa:
[00:04:26 - 00:04:27]
Okay. 

Amanda:
[00:04:27 - 00:04:27]
Okay. 

Kip:
[00:04:27 - 00:04:30]
The first one is 9.67. The second one's 9.7. 

Amanda:
[00:04:30 - 00:04:31]
Jesus Christ. 

Kip:
[00:04:32 - 00:04:52]
Like very high. So 9.65 average. We'll say 13.86 million viewers was the average. However, it peaked in the second hour at over 15 million viewers. So at the second hour we had a few more million people just tune in to be like, hey, what's going on? Isn't that weird? 

Amanda:
[00:04:52 - 00:04:53]
That is weird. 

Kip:
[00:04:55 - 00:04:59]
Like, why would you miss the first hour and Be like, oh, I wonder what's going to happen. 

Theresa:
[00:04:59 - 00:05:04]
Maybe they were watching something else first and then they were like, at least the other one's two hours. I could just catch the end. 

Amanda:
[00:05:04 - 00:05:11]
Or like, I like to think that what happened was people got on MSN messenger, which is that around the time we're still doing stuff like that. Or did we have full on cell phones at this time? 

Kip:
[00:05:12 - 00:05:14]
We had probably. What year was this? 

Amanda:
[00:05:14 - 00:05:15]
2007. 

Kip:
[00:05:16 - 00:05:22]
Oh, we had. I think that was the year the first iPhone came out. But we wouldn't have much. We had a T9 texting. 

Amanda:
[00:05:22 - 00:05:33]
I like to think people got out their T9s and they're like the Motorola razor. And then they're like, everyone. It's so good. Everyone who needs to watch this that isn't watching it. That's what I like to think. 

Kip:
[00:05:33 - 00:05:34]
And MSN for sure. 

Theresa:
[00:05:34 - 00:05:44]
Or Ican definitely change their. Like, you know how like you. You would put your username and then there would be like a thing underneath where you could put like your status. 

Kip:
[00:05:44 - 00:05:45]
Yes. 

Theresa:
[00:05:45 - 00:05:48]
Holy lost is tripping balls. 

Kip:
[00:05:48 - 00:05:48]
Yeah. 

Theresa:
[00:05:49 - 00:05:50]
Something crazy like them. 

Amanda:
[00:05:50 - 00:06:03]
I was wish I wish I BVM mess. I would have guys, I would have had so many loss related BVM messenger quotes at the top of my thing. Just been like, we have to go back. This is like my quote on my page. 

Theresa:
[00:06:03 - 00:06:03]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[00:06:04 - 00:06:05]
So lots of viewers. 

Kip:
[00:06:05 - 00:06:08]
Lots of viewers. Okay, so we had a Sawyer nicknamed Count of Zo. 

Theresa:
[00:06:09 - 00:06:10]
Yeah, Very serious. 

Amanda:
[00:06:10 - 00:06:11]
Serious Sawyer today. 

Kip:
[00:06:11 - 00:06:17]
Serious sawyer today. Serious days 90 to 91 on the island. I have four trivia questions. 

Theresa:
[00:06:17 - 00:06:18]
Oh, my God. I'm ready. 

Kip:
[00:06:18 - 00:06:19]
Okay. 

Theresa:
[00:06:19 - 00:06:20]
I'm not ready. 

Kip:
[00:06:20 - 00:06:20]
Are you ready? 

Theresa:
[00:06:20 - 00:06:21]
No. 

Kip:
[00:06:21 - 00:06:23]
Well, you better get get ready. 

Theresa:
[00:06:23 - 00:06:24]
Okay. 

Kip:
[00:06:24 - 00:06:42]
How many people were given copies of the full script prior to filming besides Cuse and Lindelof, to protect the cliffhanger ending? The final countdown. 

Theresa:
[00:06:42 - 00:06:43]
Whatever. 

Amanda:
[00:06:47 - 00:06:48]
Can you do it again? 

Kip:
[00:06:54 - 00:06:58]
We're getting Michael Gekino's score mixed up with the fight. 

Amanda:
[00:06:58 - 00:07:02]
I don't know who's gonna be more upset. I think it was two. 

Kip:
[00:07:02 - 00:07:04]
Okay, that's incorrect. 

Amanda:
[00:07:04 - 00:07:05]
Oh, we have to go back. 

Kip:
[00:07:05 - 00:07:08]
Oh, good one. One, four. 

Theresa:
[00:07:09 - 00:07:10]
Oh, Matthew Bender. 

Amanda:
[00:07:10 - 00:07:11]
Matthew Fox. 

Kip:
[00:07:11 - 00:07:15]
Benchley and Lily. Jack Bender. And then just one of the other co producer, executive producers. 

Amanda:
[00:07:16 - 00:07:21]
So literally the only people had to be in the scene and know it. Yeah, the director and someone who's probably like the script supervisor. 

Kip:
[00:07:21 - 00:07:23]
They were the only ones who got the full script. 

Theresa:
[00:07:23 - 00:07:23]
That's wild. 

Kip:
[00:07:23 - 00:07:47]
So, okay, question number two. The funeral parlor that Jack visits is called Hoff's Drawler, which is an anagram of what H O, F, F, S, D, R, A, W, L, A, R. Let me repeat the letters one more time. 

Theresa:
[00:07:47 - 00:07:47]
Yeah. 

Kip:
[00:07:49 - 00:07:59]
H, O, F, F, S, D, R, A, W, L, A, R. I. I doubt you'll get it. Okay. 

Amanda:
[00:08:00 - 00:08:02]
Does that have something to do Dharma? 

Kip:
[00:08:02 - 00:08:02]
No. 

Amanda:
[00:08:03 - 00:08:06]
I don't know then I'm really bad at anagrams. 

Theresa:
[00:08:08 - 00:08:09]
I don't know. 

Kip:
[00:08:10 - 00:08:11]
Flash forward. 

Amanda:
[00:08:12 - 00:08:12]
No. 

Kip:
[00:08:13 - 00:08:14]
Isn't that cool? 

Theresa:
[00:08:15 - 00:08:16]
That's cool. 

Kip:
[00:08:17 - 00:08:17]
Okay. 

Theresa:
[00:08:17 - 00:08:19]
Amanda's blow up Dawn. Right now. 

Kip:
[00:08:24 - 00:08:25]
Her jaw is dropped. 

Amanda:
[00:08:25 - 00:08:26]
My mouth is a gap. 

Kip:
[00:08:26 - 00:08:27]
A gap. 

Amanda:
[00:08:27 - 00:08:36]
Okay. It's a more classy, professional way to suggest what I was doing. I'm in shock. I'm not Blow up Dolly. 

Kip:
[00:08:38 - 00:08:39]
I've never heard that before. 

Amanda:
[00:08:40 - 00:08:44]
It's because I once did that, like 15 years ago. And she's like, you look like a blow up doll. 

Theresa:
[00:08:44 - 00:08:48]
Because she like vacant expression on her face while she did it. 

Kip:
[00:08:48 - 00:08:51]
Oh, question number three. 

Amanda:
[00:08:51 - 00:08:52]
Okay. 

Kip:
[00:08:52 - 00:09:07]
When did Cuse and Lindelof first start fleshing out the idea of flash forward? Still the wrong. 

Amanda:
[00:09:08 - 00:09:13]
Well, I. Teresa, don't do it enough. Oh, that's good. 

Theresa:
[00:09:16 - 00:09:17]
Yeah, there it is. 

Amanda:
[00:09:19 - 00:09:21]
Goes into it. I know. 

Kip:
[00:09:21 - 00:09:22]
That's what happened to me. 

Amanda:
[00:09:22 - 00:09:26]
Yeah. Oh, no, I think it was, like, at the beginning of season three. 

Kip:
[00:09:26 - 00:09:27]
Okay, that's wrong. 

Theresa:
[00:09:28 - 00:09:30]
I'm gonna say at the beginning of season two. 

Kip:
[00:09:31 - 00:09:38]
Incorrect. The end of season one. However, they had always intended to use flash forwards from the beginning. 

Amanda:
[00:09:39 - 00:09:41]
Okay. So they're always gonna do flashbacks. 

Kip:
[00:09:41 - 00:09:45]
Season one. They. They were like, okay, this is how we're gonna start working them into the show. 

Theresa:
[00:09:45 - 00:09:46]
That's super cool. 

Kip:
[00:09:46 - 00:09:47]
That's very. 

Amanda:
[00:09:47 - 00:09:47]
So cool. 

Kip:
[00:09:48 - 00:09:59]
Final question. Okay. How many Emmys was Through the Looking Glass nominated for this episode? 

Amanda:
[00:10:02 - 00:10:04]
Want to give it a guess, Teresa? I have no idea. 

Theresa:
[00:10:04 - 00:10:07]
I don't either. So I'm gonna say the seven wrong. 

Kip:
[00:10:08 - 00:10:11]
Five wrong. Three directing, writing, and editing. 

Theresa:
[00:10:12 - 00:10:14]
I assume there'd be a couple acting ones. 

Kip:
[00:10:14 - 00:10:17]
They won None. Yeah, Terry o' Quinn won that year, but for a different episode. 

Amanda:
[00:10:17 - 00:10:20]
Oh, he won for Mad. For Tallahassee. 

Kip:
[00:10:20 - 00:10:21]
I think so. Yeah. 

Theresa:
[00:10:21 - 00:10:27]
The brig. No, man from Tallahassee. You just said it. Why did I say the brig? Yikes. 

Amanda:
[00:10:27 - 00:10:28]
Yikes on bikes. 

Kip:
[00:10:29 - 00:10:30]
So that's it. 

Amanda:
[00:10:30 - 00:10:52]
That's a. That's some really good information out of those trivia questions. The flash forwards, to me, like, before we get into Teresa's stream of consciousness, we start very heavily in that flash forwards are so funny because that is such a, like a. A term used in the zeitgeist of, like, pop culture now. And I don't think it ever was before, like, Lost, invented A narrative. 

Kip:
[00:10:52 - 00:10:53]
I think so. 

Amanda:
[00:10:53 - 00:10:53]
Right. 

Kip:
[00:10:53 - 00:11:00]
Because there was never flash forwards. It wasn't what they called them. They called them like a future. 

Amanda:
[00:11:01 - 00:11:02]
Like a. You know, like. 

Kip:
[00:11:02 - 00:11:02]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[00:11:02 - 00:11:03]
I don't even know what they called. 

Kip:
[00:11:03 - 00:11:05]
Maybe they did, but I don't think so. 

Amanda:
[00:11:05 - 00:11:09]
I don't think they did. And I don't think they did because they were never as, like, present. 

Kip:
[00:11:09 - 00:11:11]
It was like more like a glimpse into the future. 

Amanda:
[00:11:11 - 00:11:16]
Yeah. They show, like, foreshadowing, or they'd show like. Yeah, like a future moment. 

Kip:
[00:11:16 - 00:11:19]
Like a. Like a. What's a fortune teller type. 

Amanda:
[00:11:19 - 00:11:27]
Yeah. But they would not do. Pardon me. It would not have been like a huge narrative piece. 

Kip:
[00:11:27 - 00:11:27]
No. 

Amanda:
[00:11:27 - 00:11:31]
And I think it comes specifically off the back of the flashbacks. 

Kip:
[00:11:31 - 00:11:31]
Exactly. 

Amanda:
[00:11:31 - 00:11:48]
Right. So if there hadn't been these flashbacks, which we were like, oh, in the flashback. And like, even in this write up, they're like, in today's flashback, we learned this is such a big part of it that there had to be something for this. Right. Because they just flipped the narrative. And I just think that's really cool. I love it and I'm very excited to talk about. 

Kip:
[00:11:49 - 00:11:51]
Okay, so now it is time for. 

Theresa:
[00:11:52 - 00:20:05]
Stream of consciousness also. All right, here we go. Three losties are embarking on the journey to the end of season three. Oh, Jack. Are you okay, my friend? You look different. Oh, dear. I think he's drunk. Is turbulence really that loud? Is it weird? I don't remember what's wrong with Jack. What's in the paper? Your car sounds like it's gonna break soon. Why are you sad, Jack? Why did you rip it out? Just to crumple it up also. Who are you calling? Why did you read Jack? Should you been driving to begin with? Oh, Jack, don't. Jack, don't. Jack, wait. What the heck? Oh, my God. There's still so many survivors on this island. Nah. Saeed, you're a good man. Good luck to you all on your respective missions. I love Rose and Bernard. They're literally so adorable. Carl, what are you packing? You're not from there. My God, Jin is so sweet here. Things are sounding epic. It transitioned from sweet to intense. Here we go. Bye bye. Beach huts. Where did we get the rifles from again? The others won't notice a bunch of footprints leading away from the camp. Okay. Naomi is very observant. Oh, my God. Ouch. That's brutal. Why do you keep beating Charlie like this? He's bleeding. I think he's good. Stop hitting him. Oh, we found it. The room with the flashing light. Ben writes in a journal I wonder what's in it. Today I made a man kill his father. Now his lies are coming out. I think Ryan's walkie's off. You know, they're very close to the dynamite. This is not subtle. None of this is subtle. Do they have a signal as to when to shoot? My God, there's so many of them. Oh, damn. Jan. Oh, no. Bernard. Oh, my God. This is intense. They'll see. There were only two explosions. Oh, dear. She's pregnant. I mean, just because I used to be married, she's still a visitor. No. Should we still allow her in here? Oh, Jack, don't lie. Oh, that's why she's there. Jack, you gotta change up your emergency contact, my friend. I love Rose so much. She's the best. I appreciate the effort, but I don't think anybody. Anyone believes you, Jack. I like that Rose and son have each other, though. I love that Charlie wants to save everyone so badly. She's been really a villain. Oh, Bernard, why don't do. Why don't do it. I don't know what that means. Bernard, my. Oh, yeah. This is when he's confessing. Oh, Bernard, my sweet dentist. Ben is truly terrifying. Wait, what temple are we going to? I find it interesting that he needs a map to figure out his route. How are you going to talk them out of it, Ben? How would they have caught up if they were ahead so far? Like, that was quite a ways away. Oh. Good morning. Des finally woke up. Look, his nipple. Who's shooting at him? What the hell? Oh. Mikael. Wait. They're not that far from shore. All right, Des, find the moon pool. Moon pool? This blonde is so angry. Wait, where's Des? How'd he get in there? He didn't leave, like, a trail of water anywhere? Oh, God, Jack, you're so shaky. Dude, you should probably not be mainlining pills like that. Jack, you're not chief. You gotta do what he says. Jack, what has happened to you? Aha. I knew Sawyer would want to go back. Yikes. But not with her. Come on, Jack. Kiss her. Kiss her. Oh, she kissed him. Kate saw. Now Kate's mad. Oh, there's Mikhail. He's got full scuba gear. Oh, and now they're gonna look for dez. Yikes. What is happening right now? Everyone's not trusting anyone. Whoa. Ben. You're just fucked. I need you to kill your own people. Because I say so. Like what? Wait, did Jules kiss Jack before Jack kissed Kate? Wait. He says he loves Kate. Wait, what? Kate, what are you gonna do with this? Info. Oh, my God. A runaway. A Runway for the aliens. I mean, Sawyer and Juliet are kind of hilarious together. Oh, Hurley. Hi. Oh, Sawyer. Don't. Please don't. I know why you're doing it, but come on. I mean, I wonder the same thing. Alex. Why. Why can't you. Ben, Wait. Whose eye is this? Oh, Lock. Forgot about him. Whatever. Your legs. Ew. Also, he's just on all these decomposing bodies. So gross. Oh. Okay. Pistols loaded. That's fun. What are you gonna do now, though? Oh, no, wait. Walt. Dang, Walt. What's with your voice? It sounds like you're on helium. Oh, that's all Locke wants to hear. Okay. Oh, Jack, this is a little much. Okay, you still have a scrap of paper. Do we get to read it yet? Nope. Oh, Jack. You're gonna get yourself killed, my friend. I think you're a little early. Oh, shit. That's sad for this person. Not a friend or a family member. Okay, who is it, then? Cause you seem pretty upset. Oh. Only one left. Maybe if you stop choking him down like that. I mean. Okay, Danielle, I kind of get it. Oh, my God. It's a standoff. What's gonna happen now? Jack, do not kill him. Jack looks mad. Geez, Bonnie, why are you so kill. Hungry? Damn. I think Kyle's starting to question things. Oh, Mikhail. Oh, my God, dez. This is all such a mess. Kate, where are you going? Wait. Kate, what is happening? Actually, Ben, you've killed some of their folks, too, you know, so maybe you're even. Also. You cage some people. Sir, heroes don't get whatever they want just because they're heroes. It doesn't work like that. Also, Jack. Sweet Jack. What happened? Who is she then? Ben? How is she a bad guy? Ben, this isn't gonna work. My dude. Oh, dear. What are we gonna do here? He can't do it. In a minute. This is so fucked. Oh, Jack. Oh, Ben, you asshole. Kill him. Okay. Yes. Here we go. Kill Ben. Kill him. He's not dead. This will all be over if we kill Ben, but. Okay, let's not. Damn. That's intense. 5:45. Wait. What? Good Vibrations. They're notes. Oh, she thinks she's gonna. I think she's gonna die. Oh, she's dead. Okay, so, Charlie, you're a musician. You got this. Good Vibrations. Who's gonna tie him up? Oh, dear. Alex is meeting her mama. Ben, will you tell her? Oh, my God. He did. You literally look the same. This is beautiful. Oh, my God. The first mother daughter bonding time. Tie up the fake Papa Kate. That's a dirty rag on open wounds. Damn, Jack. Damn. I get you're not happy with him, and I get that. Oh, my God. Okay, Juliet is kind of hilarious. And, oh, my God, Hurley. That's amazing. And, oh, my side. Hot damn. This beach has got me shooketh. Oh, my God. He shot him. I didn't expect that. But also for taking the kid off the raft. I get it. Oh, Jack. Jack. No. No. How is this how oxy comes in little packets? Seriously, what is happening to Jack? Oh, she was distracted by Jack and got into an accident. Well, that's awful. Jack, what happened? I'm worried about you. Did no one notice that Hurley was gone? Wow. This is an amazing moment. But no one's worried about Desmond, so that's kind of. I'm glad they pulled the lady out of the water, though. How's he gonna figure this out? How the heck does he know that? That's how these numbers work. One shot, and he's just good to go. Well, whatever. What is happening right now? Just immediately, the phone rings. Is that Penny? Wait, what's happening? Oh, that's not her boat. Oh, where the is Mikhail? Wait, what the heck is that? A grenade? What is happening right now? Is Macau gonna kill himself? Okay. Yes. Oh, the station's flooding, but only in there. Wow. That's quite the seal. Why don't you both just swim out? Oh, Charlie always still has his marker. Well, that's sad. Can't swim out the porthole. Anything? Charlie, don't. Oh, and now Aaron feels it. She's pushing more buttons than what she told him. Oh, my God. They made it. So that's just there in the middle of nowhere. Who's got Ben? Maybe ask Rousseau how to turn it off. And it's done. It's time. Oh, now Ben's turn to be tied up against something awkward. Okay, here we go. Beginning of what? And, Ben, be more clear. Be crystal clear, and maybe then everyone will know what you're talking about. Um. What the fuck? John? What the hell is happening? Why did he do that? My God. He just shot at him. What the fuck? Russo gets a hundred points. John, do you even know what you're talking about right now? Will you kill him? Why? Will you kill him? What the hell is happening? John. John, don't. You won't. Oh, God. Thank God. Do what? What the hell is everyone talking about? What is happening? Oh, look. Everyone's so happy. Ew, Ben. Spit line, though. But the episode isn't over. So, seriously, Jack, what has happened? To you. Who do you keep calling? Oh, cool point of view on the Runway, though. Must be trippy. Jack, please stop driving under the influence. Who. Now we see who this is. Who do you keep calling? Oh, it's Kate. Wait, wait. What? Old habits. Wait. Okay. The scrap paper. Finally. 

Kip:
[00:20:05 - 00:20:05]
See? 

Theresa:
[00:20:05 - 00:20:21]
Nope, we don't see. We just talk about it. Golden pass. Wait, wait, wait. Sick of lying about what? What mistake? Oh, my God. This is Post Island. Okay, confirmed. You weren't supposed to leave. We have to go back. Kate seems to be doing fine. Did they pardon her? Whole killing her dad thing. The end. 

Kip:
[00:20:24 - 00:20:32]
Interesting that you were curious about if she got pardoned or not right at the end there, because she did look like she was doing just fine. 

Theresa:
[00:20:32 - 00:20:36]
She's got a car. She. Her fate, by the. Her skin is flawless. 

Amanda:
[00:20:36 - 00:20:42]
I know, but I kind of missed, like, no makeup, Kate. Like, eventually. It's very beautiful. Yeah. 

Theresa:
[00:20:42 - 00:20:42]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[00:20:43 - 00:20:45]
It does not need a lick of makeup. 

Theresa:
[00:20:45 - 00:20:47]
No, she really doesn't. 

Kip:
[00:20:47 - 00:20:50]
She. It looked. Yeah, it's very Photoshopped what she looked like. But. 

Amanda:
[00:20:50 - 00:20:57]
No, it doesn't. I just. I want her and everyone to know that she's beautiful. You don't need anything. You're just naturally perfect. 

Kip:
[00:20:59 - 00:21:09]
Okay, I have a question. I. I think maybe you are also confused, probably. She's pushing more buttons than he told them. 

Theresa:
[00:21:10 - 00:21:14]
Oh. Then she told him because, you know, she was like, this is how you work the phone. 

Kip:
[00:21:14 - 00:21:14]
Oh. 

Theresa:
[00:21:14 - 00:21:22]
And then she, like, pushes a button and she's like, you just do this and then this, and then when she's. She's got it, she's, like, pushing three or four buttons at a time. 

Kip:
[00:21:22 - 00:21:23]
Oh, I see. Okay. 

Theresa:
[00:21:23 - 00:21:30]
And I was like, ma' am, they would have been fucked if you were dead because you lied about how to use this damn phone. 

Amanda:
[00:21:30 - 00:21:33]
Yeah, well, that might be the least of what she's lied about. 

Theresa:
[00:21:33 - 00:21:35]
So, you know, apparently. 

Amanda:
[00:21:36 - 00:21:36]
Yeah. Yeah. 

Theresa:
[00:21:36 - 00:21:40]
This is more fuzzy to me than I recall. 

Amanda:
[00:21:40 - 00:21:46]
Yeah, it's fuzzy for me a little bit, too, but not okay. Also, like, I think. 

Kip:
[00:21:47 - 00:21:57]
I don't even know. My other question was, oh, yes, I don't know. Who else could be Jack's emergency contact? Because you're like, you need to change your emergency contact, dude. 

Theresa:
[00:21:57 - 00:21:57]
His mother. 

Kip:
[00:21:58 - 00:22:00]
Oh, yeah, I forgot her. Oh, yeah. 

Theresa:
[00:22:00 - 00:22:10]
But, like, yeah, I will say they. They do do a pretty good job of not making you realize what it is until the end. 

Amanda:
[00:22:10 - 00:22:12]
I have so many comments about that. 

Kip:
[00:22:12 - 00:22:18]
And then my final comment on your stream is, I just. I love Jack's truck so much. 

Amanda:
[00:22:19 - 00:22:20]
It's like a thing or whatever. 

Kip:
[00:22:20 - 00:22:24]
It's a Ford Bronco from the 70s. I did. 

Amanda:
[00:22:24 - 00:22:24]
Yeah. 

Kip:
[00:22:27 - 00:22:29]
That's exciting. So much. I want one. 

Theresa:
[00:22:29 - 00:22:31]
It sounded a little rickety. 

Kip:
[00:22:31 - 00:22:32]
Yeah, that's how they all sound. It's great. 

Theresa:
[00:22:32 - 00:22:33]
Oh, is it? 

Amanda:
[00:22:33 - 00:22:34]
I remember that car now. 

Theresa:
[00:22:34 - 00:22:37]
I don't. I. I don't think it was gone. 

Amanda:
[00:22:37 - 00:22:38]
By the time you came around. 

Kip:
[00:22:38 - 00:22:41]
No, I had it. I'm sure I had. Well, maybe not. I don't know. 

Amanda:
[00:22:41 - 00:22:43]
But I remember you came around when I first met you. 

Kip:
[00:22:43 - 00:22:44]
Yeah. Ford Bronco. 

Amanda:
[00:22:44 - 00:22:45]
Yeah. 

Kip:
[00:22:45 - 00:22:47]
Oh, there's so much to talk about. 

Theresa:
[00:22:47 - 00:22:48]
I don't know. 

Amanda:
[00:22:48 - 00:22:51]
I'm really worried that I want to talk about so much that I'll talk about nothing. 

Kip:
[00:22:51 - 00:22:52]
This is gonna be like four hours. 

Theresa:
[00:22:53 - 00:22:58]
Hope you guys are hunkered into. Get a bag of chips, strap in. 

Kip:
[00:22:58 - 00:23:05]
Maybe a Coke Zero, and get ready for some chat about lost, because we are digging in. 

Theresa:
[00:23:05 - 00:23:15]
We are deep diving. This is. I mean, we're talking about two. An hour and a half. Two hours of quality 9.6, 9.7 television. 

Amanda:
[00:23:15 - 00:23:30]
Yeah. And let's just say, like, it's 9.6 and 9.7 for a reason, because there really isn't a down moment. Like, it's just. It's go, go, go. And, like, flawless from the beginning. Like, what is the first scene even? Like? 

Theresa:
[00:23:30 - 00:23:31]
I can tell you. 

Amanda:
[00:23:31 - 00:23:32]
Yeah, please. 

Theresa:
[00:23:33 - 00:23:39]
The first scene is. Let me just scroll all the way back up. Jack on an airplane. 

Amanda:
[00:23:39 - 00:23:39]
Right. 

Theresa:
[00:23:39 - 00:23:40]
Okay. 

Kip:
[00:23:40 - 00:23:40]
That's what. 

Amanda:
[00:23:40 - 00:23:56]
I couldn't remember if it started on the island. So let's start there immediately. Like the last flashback. So we've talked a little bit about how this was Jen and Son's episode was the last, like, traditional flashback. 

Kip:
[00:23:56 - 00:23:56]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[00:23:56 - 00:24:09]
Because then we get Ben's and then we get Charlie's. Greatest hits. So our last flashback, quotation marks with Jack before this one is him in Thailand. 

Kip:
[00:24:09 - 00:24:11]
Thailand. Stranger in a strange land. 

Theresa:
[00:24:11 - 00:24:11]
Wild to me. 

Amanda:
[00:24:11 - 00:24:15]
So we know he's not in a great place. 

Kip:
[00:24:16 - 00:24:23]
I mean, he's, like, not a bad. I mean, he's kind of pushy with the tattoo girl, and then he gets. 

Theresa:
[00:24:23 - 00:24:25]
Beat up and then they tell him to go back. 

Kip:
[00:24:26 - 00:24:33]
Yeah. So I. I've heard that, like, people try to connect. Stranger in a strange land. To be like, it was this setup for this. 

Theresa:
[00:24:34 - 00:24:35]
I can't see it. 

Kip:
[00:24:35 - 00:24:35]
I don't buy it. 

Amanda:
[00:24:36 - 00:24:53]
I don't buy it either. But I will say that it's. We don't leave. It's not like we leave him as, like, head of surgery, winning awards, making peace with his mom and Sarah. Like, he's still very Lost and not in. In the best place compared to what he could be at the end of Stranger in a Strange Land. 

Kip:
[00:24:53 - 00:24:53]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[00:24:53 - 00:24:55]
So it's not as big a stretch. 

Kip:
[00:24:55 - 00:25:02]
No, it's not. To see him on that plane, disheveled, kind of demanding more drinks and. 

Theresa:
[00:25:02 - 00:25:07]
Yeah, but he. It. I mean, it's. It still seems like a big bit of a stretch because he seems, like, wrecked. 

Amanda:
[00:25:07 - 00:25:11]
But you didn't immediately think this wasn't a flashback when you watched it? 

Theresa:
[00:25:11 - 00:25:13]
No, I assumed it was a flashback, but he was wrecked. 

Amanda:
[00:25:13 - 00:25:15]
Well, that's what I mean, though. Right. So it works. 

Kip:
[00:25:15 - 00:25:19]
You didn't put two and two. Remember that this was a flash forward. 

Theresa:
[00:25:19 - 00:25:20]
Yeah. 

Kip:
[00:25:20 - 00:25:21]
Wow. 

Theresa:
[00:25:21 - 00:25:22]
I remember. 

Kip:
[00:25:23 - 00:25:28]
I know you made a comment while we were watching it. You're like, what? But I just was wondering if it was that particular. 

Theresa:
[00:25:29 - 00:25:40]
Yeah, I don't remember it being a flash word. I remember we have to go back, but I don't remember where that is in, like, I see the scheme of things. So when it was now, I was. 

Kip:
[00:25:40 - 00:25:48]
Like, oh, that's like. That's amazing that you were still kind of sucked in to feel like it was a flashback. 

Theresa:
[00:25:48 - 00:25:48]
Yeah. 

Kip:
[00:25:48 - 00:25:50]
Having seen it a couple times. 

Theresa:
[00:25:50 - 00:25:51]
Yeah. Yep. 

Kip:
[00:25:51 - 00:25:53]
I mean, I know it's been quite a while since you've seen it, but. 

Theresa:
[00:25:54 - 00:25:55]
Yeah, I've definitely seen it at least twice. 

Kip:
[00:25:55 - 00:25:59]
So to your point, Amanda, is that it does make it. You feel like you're in a. 

Amanda:
[00:25:59 - 00:26:07]
Just a Jack flashback 100 and like, to the point where even you knowing that at some point there will be flash forwards, like, you know they exist. 

Theresa:
[00:26:07 - 00:26:08]
Yep. 

Amanda:
[00:26:08 - 00:26:17]
And even knowing. Not knowing exactly when or why or how they're going to happen, knowing it felt a little off to you. You weren't like, oh, this must be the start of the flash forwards. 

Kip:
[00:26:17 - 00:26:18]
Yeah. 

Theresa:
[00:26:18 - 00:26:21]
No, I was like, what happened to Jack that he's so up? 

Amanda:
[00:26:21 - 00:26:24]
So this is very interesting. I really, really enjoyed that. 

Kip:
[00:26:25 - 00:26:31]
Yeah. So, like, how do we want to do this? Do we want to go full flash forward? Flash back forward. 

Amanda:
[00:26:31 - 00:26:34]
Yeah, I think we should except. And then maybe leave that last scene. 

Kip:
[00:26:34 - 00:26:35]
Okay. 

Amanda:
[00:26:35 - 00:26:51]
But like. Because the flash forwards are very interesting. So he's on a plane and he gets. He's being kind of a dick. And so they won't serve him anywhere alcohol. So they give him this newspaper and he reads something very distressing. 

Kip:
[00:26:51 - 00:26:53]
Yeah. We don't know what. 

Amanda:
[00:26:53 - 00:26:54]
We don't know what. 

Theresa:
[00:26:55 - 00:26:59]
No, he just rips it and then, like, pockets it for later. 

Amanda:
[00:26:59 - 00:27:03]
Well, I'm kind of being facetious because, like, we don't know what is an AUDIENCE But Kip and I do. 

Kip:
[00:27:03 - 00:27:05]
Teresa does not remember. 

Amanda:
[00:27:05 - 00:27:06]
Teresa will not remember. 

Kip:
[00:27:07 - 00:27:08]
You don't remember who's in that coffin? 

Amanda:
[00:27:09 - 00:27:10]
Who's in the coffin? 

Kip:
[00:27:12 - 00:27:16]
You don't remember, or do you just not want to say because of spoilers? 

Theresa:
[00:27:16 - 00:27:24]
I don't know. I'm so worried about saying something. I'm being like, how do you not know that's wrong? 

Amanda:
[00:27:26 - 00:27:39]
Do you have a recollection? Because. Because you will know. Like, it's just. I. I highlight it because it's like you. It's obviously so distressing to him that it leads to what we do, but it's also like, we will find it out. 

Theresa:
[00:27:39 - 00:27:49]
But I think that's why I'm confused, because I thought I might know, but the reaction doesn't match what's happening. What. 

Amanda:
[00:27:49 - 00:27:51]
I think that makes sense and it's important. 

Theresa:
[00:27:51 - 00:27:52]
And I'm confused. 

Kip:
[00:27:52 - 00:27:54]
Yeah. No, that actually does make sense. 

Amanda:
[00:27:54 - 00:28:09]
And that does. That's important. Right. Because when you're all. Eventually it's going to all tie together. I agree with you. I think that the reaction he has to this information. Kate's reaction at the end of why would I go to that? Is more on brand. 

Kip:
[00:28:09 - 00:28:10]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[00:28:10 - 00:28:23]
With what I would think his would be. Right. So it's just interesting to know that something is distressing him enough that he's wants to take his life. 

Theresa:
[00:28:24 - 00:28:33]
Yeah. And that's what I don't get. That's what I'm confused about. Because I thought it might be someone, and then I was like, oh, it must not be, because, like, this doesn't make any sense. 

Amanda:
[00:28:33 - 00:28:36]
When you. When you thought it was a flashback still, what did you think it was? 

Theresa:
[00:28:37 - 00:28:39]
Some rando? Like a patient. 

Amanda:
[00:28:39 - 00:28:40]
Yeah. Okay. Yeah, that's fair. 

Theresa:
[00:28:40 - 00:28:43]
Because, like, you know, he takes all this so personally. 

Kip:
[00:28:43 - 00:28:43]
Yes. 

Amanda:
[00:28:43 - 00:28:55]
And that honestly might be something that would have played on people's thoughts because there's a few misdirects in the flashbacks that are done or flash forwards. See, I'm even saying flashbacks. 

Theresa:
[00:28:55 - 00:28:55]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[00:28:55 - 00:28:58]
There's a few misdirects that are so well done. 

Kip:
[00:28:58 - 00:28:58]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[00:28:59 - 00:29:17]
Because it's not. You're right. Jack takes everything so personally. Like, for all we know, he's been just whatever the version of being disbarred is, like, lost his medical license or someone he operated on died or whatever it is, and he's just can't handle it. 

Kip:
[00:29:17 - 00:29:18]
Yeah, exactly. 

Amanda:
[00:29:18 - 00:29:31]
Right. He's finding out that, like, you know, or maybe his dad's malfeasance has come to light. Right. Like, there's just so many ways it could have Gone. But to see Jack in that kind of place is rough. 

Theresa:
[00:29:32 - 00:29:59]
Oh, it's so messed up. Especially because when you're contrasting it with, like, the way he's on the island. Like, what we're seeing and then what we're. What we're seeing in the flash forward and what we're seeing on island are, like, two completely different people. And so it's very jarring to see him, like, at this, like, rock bottom. Like, I need to take a bunch of oxy. I'm drinking all the time. I want to kill myself. Like, I don't understand how we got to that point. 

Kip:
[00:30:00 - 00:30:01]
His apartment is a mess. 

Theresa:
[00:30:01 - 00:30:02]
Oh. Oh, God. 

Amanda:
[00:30:02 - 00:30:04]
We know how much you hate that after the John Locke. 

Kip:
[00:30:04 - 00:30:08]
Exactly. Do not like when people have messy apartments. 

Amanda:
[00:30:09 - 00:30:30]
I will say I have a very visceral memory of this. I first. You know, it's kind of like, where were you when JFK died? Or where were you in 9 11? What were you first thinking when you saw the flashback of. That's actually a flash forward. I remember thinking that it was Sarah's wedding announcement. 

Kip:
[00:30:31 - 00:30:31]
Okay. 

Amanda:
[00:30:32 - 00:30:33]
In the paper. 

Kip:
[00:30:33 - 00:30:33]
Right. 

Amanda:
[00:30:33 - 00:30:35]
Because they sometimes do that stuff. Like. And. 

Kip:
[00:30:35 - 00:30:36]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[00:30:36 - 00:30:42]
And so I thought that's what it was. And that. Because quite honestly, he has not been in a good place about Sarah. 

Kip:
[00:30:42 - 00:30:47]
No. Since their divorce or since that one episode where they broke up. 

Amanda:
[00:30:47 - 00:30:48]
Yeah. 

Kip:
[00:30:49 - 00:31:21]
I don't remember thinking what I thought it was, to be honest. I really don't remember. But. And I can't say because it. It's tainted in. In me. In that I will. I know exactly what's going on, so I can't really speculate. Yeah. But. But I agree. And I love going back on it, knowing everything and noticing those misdirects, like, noticing those little things, like when he's calling for his father and, like, that clearly he's just, like, drunk out of his mind and. Yeah. 

Amanda:
[00:31:22 - 00:31:34]
Yeah. Because he does have a few moments. Like, so, you know, and it's still Jack is Jack. Right. So he is. So, like, he's about to end his life, and what stops him is that someone needs help. 

Kip:
[00:31:34 - 00:31:35]
Yeah. 

Theresa:
[00:31:35 - 00:31:35]
Right. 

Amanda:
[00:31:35 - 00:31:37]
And Jack will always help. 

Theresa:
[00:31:37 - 00:31:38]
Help. 

Amanda:
[00:31:39 - 00:31:43]
So then we see him in the hospital, and Sarah gets called, and she's pregnant. 

Kip:
[00:31:43 - 00:31:44]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[00:31:44 - 00:31:47]
I'm gonna be really honest with you. Sarah's kind of a dick. 

Kip:
[00:31:48 - 00:31:48]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[00:31:48 - 00:31:49]
Like, why did she come? 

Kip:
[00:31:49 - 00:31:55]
I know. Like, you don't have to come. Like, they would have said, he's fine. He's just getting some stitches. 

Amanda:
[00:31:55 - 00:31:57]
Like, it's only. He needs to be signed out by her or anything. 

Kip:
[00:31:57 - 00:31:57]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[00:31:57 - 00:32:04]
And then to come all the way down there and be like, I can't give you a ride home. It's inappropriate. Like, why'd you. It's. It's inappropriate that you came here. 

Kip:
[00:32:04 - 00:32:05]
Why are you even here? 

Amanda:
[00:32:05 - 00:32:09]
Like, he doesn't need surgery. He doesn't need, like, someone to sign off on, like, a procedure. 

Kip:
[00:32:09 - 00:32:10]
I know. 

Amanda:
[00:32:10 - 00:32:17]
I just thought that was, like, really? Because I do. I do believe that, you know, when you're with someone a long time, like, you still care about them. Right? 

Theresa:
[00:32:17 - 00:32:17]
Totally. 

Amanda:
[00:32:18 - 00:32:27]
I'm sure that if she got a call that said he's been hurt, that she would go. But then I feel like if you were gonna go, like, you can give him a ride home. 

Kip:
[00:32:27 - 00:32:33]
Like, just go and be like, I'm giving a ride home because I'm still your emergency contact. Change it, please. 

Theresa:
[00:32:33 - 00:32:34]
Yeah, this is the last time. 

Kip:
[00:32:34 - 00:32:43]
This is the last time. But, like, yeah, why go if you're just gonna be, like, still drinking? Hey, no. Not gonna give you a ride home. Like. 

Amanda:
[00:32:43 - 00:32:44]
Yeah. 

Kip:
[00:32:44 - 00:32:46]
Is it just to show off your pregnant belly? 

Amanda:
[00:32:46 - 00:32:55]
Yeah. And I think it's, again, like, a little bit of a misjudged show. It's like, oh, look, he's still, like, look at how affected he is by Sarah's presence. It must be recent. 

Kip:
[00:32:56 - 00:32:57]
That's right. Exactly right. 

Amanda:
[00:32:57 - 00:32:59]
But no, Jack just can't let go. 

Kip:
[00:33:00 - 00:33:04]
I like the other misdirects of them calling him a hero. 

Amanda:
[00:33:04 - 00:33:04]
Yes. 

Kip:
[00:33:04 - 00:33:33]
Because, like, we assume it's for the bridge incident, but now you realize people would know he was like, well, or do you know? Like, we know, but at the same time, like, you don't really know what he's saying to Kate when he says, I'm sick of lying. I want people to know the truth. Like, okay, so do people know he was in a plane crash? But, like, so is that hero thing, too. That is, like, a really good misdirect as well. 

Amanda:
[00:33:33 - 00:33:41]
Yes. Because the only kind of giveaway to that is the new head of surgery or whatever hospital says hero twice. 

Kip:
[00:33:41 - 00:33:42]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[00:33:42 - 00:33:43]
He's like, now you're a hero two times. 

Kip:
[00:33:43 - 00:33:44]
Yeah, exactly. 

Amanda:
[00:33:44 - 00:33:56]
So. But that's the only time it's ever. The rest of. It's like, hey, it's that hero guy. Hey, it's, you know, you're a hero. And it's like, yeah, he's a hero who saved the woman. Right. But. But there's two times we're not conscious. 

Kip:
[00:33:56 - 00:34:00]
So what's the first? Yeah, exactly. So I like that one. 

Theresa:
[00:34:00 - 00:34:01]
I did not catch that. 

Amanda:
[00:34:01 - 00:34:13]
Yeah. And they don't. But they probably don't want you to. Right. Like, that's why it's so good. Because most. There's so many misdirects. But there are just a few Easter eggs as well. Right. Just to kind of keep you guys. 

Kip:
[00:34:13 - 00:34:14]
Exactly. 

Amanda:
[00:34:14 - 00:34:18]
So I consider that a bit the first Easter egg kind of of the whole. 

Theresa:
[00:34:18 - 00:34:18]
Damn. 

Kip:
[00:34:19 - 00:34:19]
He. 

Amanda:
[00:34:19 - 00:34:26]
He is like, you know, and it's so interesting because, like, he is kind of at the place he was with Sarah. 

Kip:
[00:34:26 - 00:34:27]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[00:34:27 - 00:34:35]
Right. And so you actually. And because they don't always go super linear. This could be before Thailand as well. 

Kip:
[00:34:35 - 00:34:35]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[00:34:35 - 00:34:45]
It could have been a continuation of that time that she kind of leaves him crying on the street. Or it could be after Thailand because he's not. Whatever. Or it could be in the future. Right. Like, it's nuts. 

Kip:
[00:34:45 - 00:34:53]
I felt it was more in line with. Yeah. That episode with Sarah when he's like obsessed with her new partner. 

Theresa:
[00:34:53 - 00:34:54]
Oh, yeah. Yeah. 

Kip:
[00:34:54 - 00:35:14]
And like he's like following people and like obsessive. And like I said, his. Other than the beard, like, it seemed very much in line with that sort of like downward spiral. Jack versus Thailand. Weird. Jack. But I get the. Like, we don't know when it is. 

Amanda:
[00:35:14 - 00:35:15]
No. 

Kip:
[00:35:15 - 00:35:17]
And it could fit in multiple times. 

Amanda:
[00:35:18 - 00:35:31]
Yeah. So. And at some point, like, we see him spiraling. We see him doing like, trying to get drugs. We see him go to the funeral home or whatever he read in the paper. 

Kip:
[00:35:31 - 00:35:47]
Yeah. And like, I don't know, Matthew Fox seems to be able to just go like glossy eyed instantly. I don't know. I. I doubt there was that many takes. When he like reads that paper initially and his eyes just go wet, like, wow, he's so good. 

Amanda:
[00:35:47 - 00:35:57]
He's a. He's a good actor. We'll talk when we. There's a few moments on the beach, like around the island where I'm just like, he really is a phenomenal actor. 

Kip:
[00:35:57 - 00:36:07]
I know. Yeah. So, yeah, he's at the funeral parlor, which was a very depressing funeral parlor. Hofstrawler. 

Theresa:
[00:36:08 - 00:36:10]
And there's. There's no one there. 

Kip:
[00:36:10 - 00:36:10]
No. 

Amanda:
[00:36:10 - 00:36:12]
That's just really sad. 

Theresa:
[00:36:13 - 00:36:17]
Like, he's like, I think I'm early or I think I missed it. 

Kip:
[00:36:17 - 00:36:18]
Yeah. Nope, nope. Came. 

Theresa:
[00:36:19 - 00:36:22]
And then he's like, are you friend or family? He's like, neither. I'm like, I don't understand. 

Kip:
[00:36:22 - 00:36:25]
Like, who are you that. Well, he's clearly very upset. 

Theresa:
[00:36:26 - 00:36:27]
Very upset. 

Kip:
[00:36:28 - 00:36:34]
It's like, but how if he's not a friend or a family, who is this? Who are you to this man or person? 

Theresa:
[00:36:34 - 00:36:39]
Yeah. Because he's like, do you want to open it? And I was like, open it, open it, open it. And they don't open it. 

Kip:
[00:36:39 - 00:36:41]
They don't open it for a long time. 

Amanda:
[00:36:41 - 00:36:43]
Oh, way too long. 

Kip:
[00:36:43 - 00:36:44]
Yeah. I might say they dragged. 

Theresa:
[00:36:44 - 00:37:02]
And then he, like, puts his hand on the thing, and I'm like, well, you know, you feel something for this person, clearly, because if you didn't, like, say it was someone, like, something you, like, didn't care about and you showed up for whatever reason, you wouldn't go as far as to, like. I feel like it's a very intimate act to put your hand on someone's coffin. 

Amanda:
[00:37:03 - 00:37:26]
It just. It's hard because at this point, Jack. Sorry, Jack, is a very unreliable narrator to what's happening. Right. So is he really upset because he's popping pills and drunk out of his mind and so everything's upsetting him and more severe than it is, or is it someone who completely has this huge effect on his entire existence? Right. 

Kip:
[00:37:26 - 00:37:32]
Because literally, he just walked in front of a car on his way into this and didn't give a. 

Theresa:
[00:37:33 - 00:37:34]
You didn't even clinch. 

Amanda:
[00:37:35 - 00:37:38]
And then it's like, literally, like, popping the pill while standing at the casket. 

Kip:
[00:37:38 - 00:37:41]
Like, okay, you are in a dark place, sir. 

Theresa:
[00:37:41 - 00:37:41]
I don't. 

Kip:
[00:37:41 - 00:37:42]
I don't. I don't know. 

Theresa:
[00:37:42 - 00:37:43]
I don't get it. 

Amanda:
[00:37:43 - 00:37:45]
It's hard to know exactly what's going on with him. 

Kip:
[00:37:45 - 00:37:46]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[00:37:46 - 00:38:02]
And that is kind of the tone of the. His flashbacks. It's just kind of hitting home, this idea that he's lying to Sarah, he's lying to the hospital, he's trying to operate when he. They're trying to very politely tell him, like, no, you're not going to do that. 

Kip:
[00:38:02 - 00:38:05]
Because I don't actually think he works there at all anymore. 

Amanda:
[00:38:05 - 00:38:06]
I don't think so either. 

Kip:
[00:38:06 - 00:38:20]
I think they're just kind of being like. It's kind of like the old retiree who can't stop coming into the workplace, so everyone just sort of, like, treats him kindly, and it's like, okay, here's some envelopes. Please don't get in the way. You can still come around because you don't have a life. 

Amanda:
[00:38:20 - 00:38:52]
Well, and like, I. What. What's really sad and I think is. Is something to concentrate on is that they're clearly drawing a huge parallel between Christian's kind of downfall and Jack's. Oh, yeah, Right. So kind of the way they kind of treated Christian with kid gloves. It's kind of what they're doing with Jack. Right. Is like, exactly like you said. Kip. Like, I don't think he works there. I don't think that he has any right to be there. If he does work there, I think that they probably let him, like, come pen salt and, like, not near a freaking scalpel. 

Kip:
[00:38:53 - 00:39:03]
No. Hell, no. It's just awkward. Like, he's like, the. The new chief of staff or chief surgery is being so polite and, like, trying to be so kind. 

Theresa:
[00:39:03 - 00:39:03]
Oh, yeah. 

Kip:
[00:39:03 - 00:39:17]
Like, come on, let's go talk to my office. Dr. Shepherd, you know, like, we can, but the. The surgeon's going to be doing it. You know, don't worry about it. Go home, have a drink, relax kind of thing. But it's, like, not working. 

Theresa:
[00:39:18 - 00:39:22]
No. And he's like, I called you three times about this. Like, he definitely didn't have to. Like. 

Amanda:
[00:39:22 - 00:39:34]
Yeah, no, I. I think that out of respect for who he is and how, you know, talented he is and how, you know, venerated at one point he probably was. 

Kip:
[00:39:35 - 00:39:37]
And for what he's been through now. 

Amanda:
[00:39:37 - 00:39:38]
Exactly. 

Kip:
[00:39:38 - 00:39:40]
Knowing where he's been. Right. 

Amanda:
[00:39:41 - 00:40:00]
Like, they pros. Like, there's a lot of trauma. Right. And so I think they are doing a lot for him, and they're letting a thought slide, and it's definitely not helping. No, exactly, because we get that scene where he's going into the pharmacy and he's, like, essentially begging for pills. And that guy. 

Kip:
[00:40:01 - 00:40:03]
Yeah. Like, come on. Don't know who this guy is. 

Theresa:
[00:40:03 - 00:40:04]
He's a hero. 

Kip:
[00:40:04 - 00:40:05]
He's a hero. Give him what he wants. 

Theresa:
[00:40:05 - 00:40:08]
Not how it works. Not how it works. 

Kip:
[00:40:08 - 00:40:10]
You can't just give pills to anybody. Because they're a hero. 

Theresa:
[00:40:10 - 00:40:11]
Yeah, no, absolutely. 

Kip:
[00:40:11 - 00:40:13]
Or because you called from the audience behind. 

Amanda:
[00:40:13 - 00:40:24]
Yeah. That's the first kind of instance of the father mentioned that you mentioned. Kip. This says he gets his father to write out a prescription. 

Kip:
[00:40:24 - 00:40:25]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[00:40:25 - 00:40:27]
Which also, I don't think is overly appropriate. 

Theresa:
[00:40:27 - 00:40:28]
No, it's not. 

Amanda:
[00:40:28 - 00:40:30]
I don't think you're supposed to treat your own family member. 

Kip:
[00:40:30 - 00:40:32]
I'm sure that's not okay. 

Amanda:
[00:40:33 - 00:40:39]
But. Yeah, so then he has a little freak out there, and then ends up popping the pills in the little packets. 

Theresa:
[00:40:39 - 00:40:40]
Little pecket pills. 

Kip:
[00:40:40 - 00:40:47]
Little pack of pills. Yeah. And then he's just kind of drunk in his apartment, and you see tickets, airplane tickets, and you see maps. 

Amanda:
[00:40:47 - 00:40:49]
Which is the second Easter egg. 

Kip:
[00:40:49 - 00:40:50]
Yeah, exactly. 

Amanda:
[00:40:51 - 00:40:55]
Because why does he have all these maps out of, like, whatever. With Oceanic. 

Kip:
[00:40:56 - 00:40:56]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[00:40:56 - 00:41:03]
Right. So. And that one, I think, is probably supposed to clue you in a little bit. But it's right when he calls, who. 

Kip:
[00:41:03 - 00:41:04]
We find out is Kate. 

Amanda:
[00:41:04 - 00:41:05]
Yeah. 

Kip:
[00:41:05 - 00:41:10]
Keeps calling someone and never answering. And finally she answers. But. But you don't hear a voice, which is interesting. 

Amanda:
[00:41:11 - 00:41:15]
You hear a. Right when she says hello. And I actually do kind of feel like it sounds like her a bit. 

Kip:
[00:41:15 - 00:41:18]
I don't remember. Oh. So I didn't even think you heard that. 

Amanda:
[00:41:18 - 00:41:23]
Then they cut her. Yeah. Then it's just him talking to her. I wonder why she answered that time. 

Kip:
[00:41:23 - 00:41:26]
Yeah, I wonder that too. If she was just like, I gotta. 

Amanda:
[00:41:26 - 00:41:27]
Get this over with. 

Kip:
[00:41:27 - 00:41:29]
What does he want? Yeah. 

Theresa:
[00:41:29 - 00:41:33]
Or it could have been one of those things where you're not paying attention and then you just answer the phone. 

Kip:
[00:41:33 - 00:41:34]
Yeah, It's. 

Theresa:
[00:41:34 - 00:41:35]
It's Jack. You're like, God damn it. 

Kip:
[00:41:35 - 00:41:43]
Before. This was before, probably. You probably just said iPhones and stuff, so you can't see who exactly. Did they have caller id? 

Amanda:
[00:41:43 - 00:41:48]
They did. I remember caller ID being so weird back then. Like, a lot of it was unknown caller. 

Kip:
[00:41:48 - 00:41:49]
Yeah. Yeah. 

Amanda:
[00:41:49 - 00:41:51]
I think you had to have them in your phone. 

Theresa:
[00:41:51 - 00:41:52]
I think so. 

Amanda:
[00:41:52 - 00:41:55]
To have it show up, as weird as that sounds. 

Kip:
[00:41:55 - 00:41:56]
Yeah, I think that's true. 

Amanda:
[00:41:57 - 00:42:02]
So anyway, she shows. So he. Apparently they know to meet at the airport, which is strange. 

Kip:
[00:42:02 - 00:42:02]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[00:42:03 - 00:42:05]
And we'll get to that. Maybe we'll leave that. 

Kip:
[00:42:05 - 00:42:13]
Yeah, let's leave that. But I mean, like, Jack's flash quote unquote back, we've kind of gone over. But it's not. It's looking grim. It's looking grim for Drac. 

Theresa:
[00:42:13 - 00:42:14]
It is looking grim. 

Amanda:
[00:42:14 - 00:42:14]
Whatever. 

Theresa:
[00:42:15 - 00:42:38]
One season dad mentioned that we forgot to talk about was when he goes. And this is why I think this, like, cemented that. I. It. I didn't know what I was talking about, like, in my mind and why I didn't think it was a flash forward. Because he's like, go find my dad right now. And if he's drunker than I am, then whatever. 

Kip:
[00:42:38 - 00:42:38]
Yeah. 

Theresa:
[00:42:38 - 00:42:43]
And I remember thinking, like, okay, so his dad's still alive here. He's just in a pit of despair. 

Kip:
[00:42:44 - 00:42:47]
Yeah. And I think it was just Jack being strung out on pills. 

Theresa:
[00:42:47 - 00:42:47]
Oh. 

Kip:
[00:42:47 - 00:42:51]
100 alcohol. And just forgetting the reality he's in. 

Theresa:
[00:42:51 - 00:42:51]
That his dad is. 

Kip:
[00:42:51 - 00:42:52]
Yeah. 

Theresa:
[00:42:52 - 00:42:53]
No. 

Amanda:
[00:42:54 - 00:42:57]
Yeah. Which is just. Yeah. No. 

Kip:
[00:43:00 - 00:43:10]
And so, like you said, Teresa, this is a very different Jack than what we're seeing on Island. Like, a leader, full of purpose, full of vengeance. 

Amanda:
[00:43:11 - 00:43:18]
Very lot. Like. And. And making choices that are not even, like, the heart choices. Like, he's thinking with his mind. 

Kip:
[00:43:18 - 00:43:19]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[00:43:19 - 00:43:29]
He's thinking logically. He's thinking, you know, not as cold as it might be at Times he's focused, he's thinking of the bigger picture. He has a mission and he is going to see it out. 

Theresa:
[00:43:29 - 00:43:31]
He will execute. 

Kip:
[00:43:31 - 00:43:42]
Yeah. And I mean, so we see them leaving on the journey, leaving behind Bernard, JYN and Saeed to execute the D plan Y. 

Amanda:
[00:43:42 - 00:43:46]
And such a cute, cute, cute scene with him and Zed. 

Kip:
[00:43:46 - 00:43:56]
Jack. Yeah, Zed. Yeah. Like when J. When Saeed's basically saying like if things go south here, you keep going, don't let us die in vain or something like that. 

Amanda:
[00:43:56 - 00:44:01]
Say it specifically says that he is willing to give his life for a chance for them to get rescued. 

Kip:
[00:44:01 - 00:44:02]
I know that's insane. 

Amanda:
[00:44:02 - 00:44:04]
And I was like. And then shakes his hand. 

Kip:
[00:44:04 - 00:44:04]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[00:44:04 - 00:44:11]
Like it's just such a, you know, beautiful idea. Because I truly believe that's the case. 

Kip:
[00:44:11 - 00:44:18]
Totally. Totally. Yeah. And I, I saw trees lean over and add points, I assume. Adding points for Saeed. 

Amanda:
[00:44:18 - 00:44:19]
I took them away. 

Kip:
[00:44:19 - 00:44:20]
Yeah. 

Theresa:
[00:44:20 - 00:44:21]
Son of a. 

Kip:
[00:44:21 - 00:44:22]
Did not care for that. 

Amanda:
[00:44:22 - 00:44:35]
So that. I thought that was a very like for where they're at in their, their relationship and friendship. What they both know they have to do. I thought that was a really like poignant, quick, succinct goodbye for those two. 

Kip:
[00:44:35 - 00:44:36]
Yeah, it was good. 

Amanda:
[00:44:36 - 00:44:48]
We're both going to do what we have to do. Good luck. We both are willing to die for this mission to continue. Contrasted with the next goodbye scene, which is Rose and Bernard. 

Kip:
[00:44:48 - 00:44:49]
Oh, so cute. 

Theresa:
[00:44:50 - 00:44:51]
Repeat after me. 

Kip:
[00:44:52 - 00:44:53]
I am not Rambo. 

Amanda:
[00:44:53 - 00:44:56]
I am a dentist. I am not Rambo. 

Kip:
[00:44:56 - 00:44:56]
So good. 

Amanda:
[00:44:57 - 00:45:03]
But when she says, if I said I would help with your SOI sign, would that change your mind? Because I actually teared up at that. Because. 

Kip:
[00:45:03 - 00:45:08]
So cute. Like, because we all mocked the SOS sign, including Rose. 

Theresa:
[00:45:08 - 00:45:08]
Yep. 

Amanda:
[00:45:08 - 00:45:15]
And it's just this idea like, no, he isn't Rambo. Right. He's not say dentist. 

Kip:
[00:45:16 - 00:45:17]
Old man dentist. 

Theresa:
[00:45:17 - 00:45:21]
He's an older man. Older man. Older man dentist. 

Kip:
[00:45:21 - 00:45:42]
Yeah. And he's. But he's a crack shot. So he's gonna. And he did not miss. But he did not. However, before we get to that, we, we are underwater at the looking glass because this is how Ben finds out that they have been warned. And Bonnie, very aggressive. 

Theresa:
[00:45:42 - 00:45:47]
She's very aggressive. She's very. Seemed bloodthirsty, I guess would be the best word. 

Amanda:
[00:45:47 - 00:45:48]
There's a lot going on down there. 

Theresa:
[00:45:48 - 00:45:57]
Yeah, I, I mean, I get it. But other one. Brown haired lady forget her name. I don't think they gave her a name. I don't think they gave her a name. 

Amanda:
[00:45:57 - 00:45:59]
She was on Once Upon a Time though, after this. 

Kip:
[00:45:59 - 00:46:02]
Oh, no, she had a name because. 

Amanda:
[00:46:02 - 00:46:17]
It said Bonnie and whatever. Yeah, but she's a. No, she's. I'll look it up. She's very. She went on to be, like, a very big role on a very popular TV show after this called Once Upon a Time. Once upon a time, she. 

Theresa:
[00:46:17 - 00:46:20]
She looks a little like Jennifer Goodwin. 

Kip:
[00:46:20 - 00:46:21]
You know what? 

Amanda:
[00:46:21 - 00:46:22]
She was on it with Jennifer Goodwin. 

Kip:
[00:46:23 - 00:46:25]
When I watched this with Dan, she. 

Amanda:
[00:46:25 - 00:46:26]
Was an evil queen. 

Kip:
[00:46:26 - 00:46:29]
He thought that was Sawyer's ex. 

Theresa:
[00:46:30 - 00:46:31]
Oh, Cassidy. 

Kip:
[00:46:31 - 00:46:41]
He thought that was Cassidy. And he was convinced, even though I said, no. But that's. That does speak to the show where they're always throwing in connections and weird, random things. 

Amanda:
[00:46:41 - 00:46:42]
Greta. 

Kip:
[00:46:42 - 00:46:42]
Greta. 

Theresa:
[00:46:42 - 00:46:43]
That's Greta. 

Kip:
[00:46:44 - 00:46:48]
But I was like, no, it is not Cassidy. She does kind of look like her. 

Theresa:
[00:46:48 - 00:46:50]
Yeah. A little bit. Kind of brown hair. 

Kip:
[00:46:51 - 00:46:56]
Extra brown hair. But, yeah. They're very upset with Charlie beating the. Out of him. 

Amanda:
[00:46:56 - 00:46:58]
Yeah. There's a lot of blood in this episode. 

Theresa:
[00:46:58 - 00:47:01]
Spitting blood. And she was still hitting him. 

Kip:
[00:47:01 - 00:47:03]
Yeah. Greta's like, ease up. Relax. 

Theresa:
[00:47:03 - 00:47:06]
Yeah. And Bonnie's like, now, smack, smack. 

Amanda:
[00:47:06 - 00:47:10]
I'm gonna get the gun. The spear gun. 

Kip:
[00:47:10 - 00:47:10]
Yeah. 

Theresa:
[00:47:10 - 00:47:11]
Yeah. What the hell? 

Amanda:
[00:47:12 - 00:47:12]
Yeah. 

Kip:
[00:47:12 - 00:47:36]
I mean, the other thing we missed is Desmond pops in and he's like, hey, Kyle, go hide. Because they're arguing in the other room. But then Mikhail shows up, and this is how Ben finds out, because Mikhail's there, and he's all confused because he was told, like, everybody else. This. I. This station was flooded, and he wasn't told. And he's the calm guy. He's a communications guy. 

Theresa:
[00:47:36 - 00:47:37]
Yeah, yeah. 

Kip:
[00:47:37 - 00:47:41]
And he wasn't told that his communications were being blocked, so that's up. 

Amanda:
[00:47:41 - 00:47:47]
I think there's. I think we're a little confused about, like, the order of what's happening because, like, when, like, he does talk. 

Theresa:
[00:47:47 - 00:47:49]
No, no. What are you talking about? 

Amanda:
[00:47:50 - 00:47:50]
Well, because. 

Kip:
[00:47:51 - 00:47:53]
Oh, yeah. Because Ben sends Mikhail. 

Amanda:
[00:47:53 - 00:47:54]
Yeah. There's a whole scene with Ben. 

Theresa:
[00:47:54 - 00:47:56]
Oh, we're talking about that. Yeah. 

Amanda:
[00:47:56 - 00:48:00]
Yeah. And, like, Ben's already talked to them about what's going on. 

Kip:
[00:48:00 - 00:48:00]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[00:48:00 - 00:48:20]
And, like, I think it's important. Just. The only reason I bring it up is because I think even that scene between Ben, Michaela, and Richard is, like, they already. Like, even Richard is like, he makes the kind of a face where he's like. Like, I don't know what's going on. And he wants to send him down there. And he's like, but you told us it flood. And he's like, I lied. 

Kip:
[00:48:20 - 00:48:21]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[00:48:21 - 00:48:51]
And. And it's like he now has to. Essentially, he's in a place where now he has to tell them all how much he's been deceiving them. And you can tell, like, especially Richard. Like, I think everyone else has their own, like, issues with it, but Richard is, like, clearly very loyal and formal and, like, been around a long time. And you can see in his face, like. And to me, as a viewer, I remember being like, yeah, if that guy is, like, starting to question this, this is not good. 

Kip:
[00:48:51 - 00:48:52]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[00:48:52 - 00:48:53]
Because Mikhail's crazy. Right. 

Kip:
[00:48:53 - 00:48:58]
Like, feels crazy. But Richard is. He. He's very smart. 

Amanda:
[00:48:58 - 00:48:59]
He seems like a businessman. 

Kip:
[00:48:59 - 00:49:00]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[00:49:00 - 00:49:00]
Right. Like. 

Kip:
[00:49:00 - 00:49:10]
And, like, I mean, Ben's whole thing for the longest time was like, while he's very manipulative and controlling, his. He's like, I'm a man of my word. 

Theresa:
[00:49:10 - 00:49:10]
Yeah. 

Kip:
[00:49:10 - 00:49:14]
Like, I. I don't lie, but I'm a man of my word and I'll. 

Amanda:
[00:49:14 - 00:49:15]
Do what I say. 

Kip:
[00:49:15 - 00:49:22]
Yes. And. But it's like, now he's literally having to tell people he's actually lied about this and pretty massive things. Like, big things. 

Theresa:
[00:49:22 - 00:49:23]
Yeah. 

Kip:
[00:49:23 - 00:49:26]
So, like, it's just things are starting to unravel for Ben. 

Theresa:
[00:49:27 - 00:49:28]
Yeah. Yeah. 

Amanda:
[00:49:28 - 00:49:58]
And it's like. Like I said for me, like, you know how, like, there's certain things, like, whenever I watch Harry Potter, read Harry Potter, if I saw. If I knew Dumbledore was around, I like, felt kind of okay. I kind of feel like that with Richard, I was like, if Richard seems, like, kind of even keeled, like, I kind of feel like there's still some semblance of control here, but with him being like, I don't know, boss, like, what's going on here? It's like, you know, like, something is very off. Yeah, exactly. Right. And that's why Mikhail ends up down there. And what you're saying about how. 

Kip:
[00:49:58 - 00:49:59]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[00:49:59 - 00:50:06]
Then he, like, I don't know if Ben meant to do that when he sent him down there or just once he got down there. 

Kip:
[00:50:07 - 00:50:24]
Well, that's just it. Like, Ben, I think, is making up as he goes along right now because he didn't really fully think about what Mikhail would walk into being. These two other others who are basically saying, well, we're here. Ben told us we couldn't say anything, and we've been blocking all of your communications. 

Theresa:
[00:50:25 - 00:50:26]
Yeah. Which is wild. 

Kip:
[00:50:26 - 00:50:27]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[00:50:27 - 00:50:30]
Yeah. It's super, super, super messed up. 

Kip:
[00:50:30 - 00:50:36]
So it's. It's sowing a bit of distrust amongst them, and Charlie's trying to take advantage. 

Amanda:
[00:50:37 - 00:50:38]
Yeah. He's being kind of funny about it. 

Kip:
[00:50:38 - 00:50:39]
He's yeah, he was good. 

Theresa:
[00:50:39 - 00:50:43]
He was. He was in top form today. Even though he was tied up and getting beaten to. 

Kip:
[00:50:43 - 00:50:44]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[00:50:44 - 00:50:55]
You know, it's funny, because Ben is good at this still, like, to a degree. Right? Because he's. He does convince Mikhail to get back on board. Yeah. 

Kip:
[00:50:55 - 00:50:59]
Like, Ben is so blood. Like, he's so casual with killing. 

Theresa:
[00:51:00 - 00:51:00]
Yeah. 

Kip:
[00:51:00 - 00:51:14]
Like, it's just. Like, you're gonna have to kill Charlie, and then that means you're gonna have to kill Greta and Bonnie as well. Like, help me clean up this mess I've made by killing three people. Just so casual. 

Theresa:
[00:51:14 - 00:51:15]
Yeah. I don't have to do it. 

Kip:
[00:51:16 - 00:51:16]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[00:51:17 - 00:51:20]
He has no. I. I don't even know. Like, he did kill his father. 

Kip:
[00:51:21 - 00:51:22]
Yeah, right. 

Theresa:
[00:51:22 - 00:51:23]
Like, he did. 

Amanda:
[00:51:23 - 00:51:30]
I mean, a lot of Ben's stuff is, like, inaction that causes consequences, but sometimes he will take a step if he needs to. Like, he shot John. 

Kip:
[00:51:30 - 00:51:32]
Yeah. I think he thinks he killed John. 

Amanda:
[00:51:32 - 00:51:47]
Yeah. Like, so I do think he tries to keep his hands clean, but I don't think it's because he doesn't want to do the killing. I think it's just easier to be one, like, step away. Right, Exactly. But I think he has no problem watching people die. He has no problem ordering people to die, and he has no problem killing people. Like, it's crazy. 

Kip:
[00:51:47 - 00:51:48]
It is crazy. 

Theresa:
[00:51:49 - 00:51:50]
Yeah. He's messed up. 

Kip:
[00:51:50 - 00:51:54]
Like, and. And Mikhail's like, okay, fine, I'll do it. 

Amanda:
[00:51:57 - 00:52:01]
How is it that Desmond let him go when Charlie didn't want him to? 

Kip:
[00:52:02 - 00:52:03]
Desmond let him go. 

Amanda:
[00:52:03 - 00:52:08]
Let Mikhail go when they. When he. They were in the woods or in the jungle. 

Kip:
[00:52:08 - 00:52:09]
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. 

Amanda:
[00:52:09 - 00:52:22]
I remember thinking that after now, having watched it being like, when that scene happens, and Charles, like, you're not gonna let him go. And he's like, we're not gonna keep him here. We're not gonna kill him. That's not, like, who we are kind of thing. And they just. Charlie would have had him be killed. And Desmond was like, you can go. 

Kip:
[00:52:22 - 00:52:23]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[00:52:23 - 00:52:36]
And because of that, Charlie is dead. It just goes to show, like, his actions do have consequences, even if they're not immediate. Right, exactly. That being said, would someone else probably have come down and had a similar result? Sure. But can you imagine being Charlie in that moment, being like, I wanted you? 

Kip:
[00:52:36 - 00:52:40]
Yeah. Like, Desmond, I told you you should. 

Theresa:
[00:52:40 - 00:52:41]
Have written that stuff. 

Kip:
[00:52:41 - 00:52:45]
Yeah. I told you to kill Mikhail. Yeah, whatever. 

Amanda:
[00:52:45 - 00:52:48]
I could just Photoshop that one. Told you we should kill Mikhail instead. 

Kip:
[00:52:48 - 00:52:55]
Of Not Benny's boat. Yeah. So, I mean, and then he does. He kills Them both. 

Amanda:
[00:52:55 - 00:52:56]
Or he shoots. 

Kip:
[00:52:57 - 00:53:05]
Right? He shoots Greta and the. And she falls in the moon pool. Moon pool. And then shoots Bonnie in the back. Shoots Bonnie in the back. 

Amanda:
[00:53:05 - 00:53:08]
Why did he, like, wait so long to shoot her? 

Kip:
[00:53:08 - 00:53:09]
I don't know. 

Amanda:
[00:53:10 - 00:53:12]
Because he shot her and then was just kind of staring at her. 

Theresa:
[00:53:12 - 00:53:12]
And. 

Amanda:
[00:53:12 - 00:53:14]
And then she's like. He should have just been like, boom. Boom. 

Kip:
[00:53:14 - 00:53:19]
I know. That's what I was expecting. And then he just wait. And she starts running. And then. Then boom. 

Amanda:
[00:53:19 - 00:53:20]
Follows her very closely. 

Theresa:
[00:53:20 - 00:53:25]
Amanda, Amanda, I need you to keep your. Your restless leg syndrome to yourself. 

Amanda:
[00:53:25 - 00:53:26]
I can't. Okay, I'll go this way. 

Kip:
[00:53:26 - 00:53:33]
But yeah, it was weird. And then Desmond pops out of the locker and shoots Mikhail with. 

Amanda:
[00:53:33 - 00:53:35]
Oh, that was beautiful. 

Theresa:
[00:53:35 - 00:53:36]
Good timing. 

Amanda:
[00:53:36 - 00:53:38]
Yeah, that was beautiful. 

Theresa:
[00:53:38 - 00:53:39]
Good timing. 

Kip:
[00:53:39 - 00:53:46]
So beautiful. Yeah. And. And. And they just like save the day kind of. Because then they. They're able to talk to Bonnie and get the code. 

Amanda:
[00:53:48 - 00:53:50]
Yeah, the code. 

Theresa:
[00:53:50 - 00:53:51]
I don't. Okay. 

Amanda:
[00:53:51 - 00:53:52]
I don't get it. 

Theresa:
[00:53:52 - 00:53:53]
We need to talk about this code. 

Kip:
[00:53:53 - 00:53:54]
Okay. 

Theresa:
[00:53:55 - 00:54:03]
What Good vibrations. He has not heard a lick of any of these. But what these buttons sound like. 

Amanda:
[00:54:03 - 00:54:04]
That's what I was thinking, but. 

Theresa:
[00:54:04 - 00:54:09]
And he does it on the first try. He's like, which one sounds like. 

Amanda:
[00:54:09 - 00:54:32]
I think. Because this is how. Because I thought about this a lot while we're eating dinner. I'm not even joking. It. I played way too big of a role in the little break we took between watching and recording. I thought about it a lot because I also that thought. I'm like, you think he'd have to play around with it a bit. But I think because he's a musician, he knows probably like that the 5 will be a tone. The 4 would be a tone higher and the 7 be a tone lower. 

Kip:
[00:54:32 - 00:54:36]
Maybe because. Yeah, remember, touch tone phones. 

Theresa:
[00:54:36 - 00:54:37]
No, like, I get that. 

Kip:
[00:54:37 - 00:54:38]
And those have tones. 

Theresa:
[00:54:38 - 00:54:51]
But there's no. Like, he's a musician. Yes, I understand that. I understand that she said start a five, so. But like, she didn't say where to start in Good Vibrations. She didn't say. 

Amanda:
[00:54:52 - 00:54:59]
Okay, well, first of all, we all know that if you're singing, you don't start with. What's the first line of Good Vibration? No one knows. But you know what you do know? 

Kip:
[00:55:01 - 00:55:02]
Good Vibrations. 

Amanda:
[00:55:03 - 00:55:04]
Exactly. 

Theresa:
[00:55:04 - 00:55:05]
I sure as didn't. 

Amanda:
[00:55:05 - 00:55:07]
Well, you went to the concert, so you should. 

Theresa:
[00:55:08 - 00:55:10]
Well, you saw the look on my face during. 

Amanda:
[00:55:10 - 00:55:16]
So I agree it's a little bit far fetched. But also, I do think being told, like, it's 5, 4, 7, 5, 4. 

Kip:
[00:55:16 - 00:55:20]
1, 1, whatever yeah, I'm sure it was a good head start. 

Theresa:
[00:55:20 - 00:55:21]
I'm just saying. 

Kip:
[00:55:21 - 00:55:26]
I know, but it's one of those things where you just gotta look a little bit beyond those little details. Details. 

Amanda:
[00:55:26 - 00:55:28]
But it was also cute because he. 

Theresa:
[00:55:28 - 00:55:29]
He was very excited. 

Amanda:
[00:55:29 - 00:55:35]
What I like about it is this whole idea that Charlie had to be the one who did this. 

Kip:
[00:55:35 - 00:55:35]
Yes. 

Theresa:
[00:55:35 - 00:55:36]
Because I did like that. 

Amanda:
[00:55:36 - 00:55:38]
He's the musician of them. Right? 

Kip:
[00:55:38 - 00:55:39]
Exactly. No one else could have gotten it. 

Theresa:
[00:55:39 - 00:55:46]
No. If it was DEZ who had gone down there, he'd be like, what are the Beach Boys? I need the actual code, please. I need the numbers. 

Kip:
[00:55:46 - 00:55:59]
Well, I mean, she did give them to them, and then I. What I was thinking was, in the time it took you to explain how it was programmed by a musician, and it's the Beach Boys and good vibr. You could have just said the numbers again. 

Theresa:
[00:55:59 - 00:56:03]
Yeah. Why didn't she start again? He's like, start again. And she's like, five, four. 

Kip:
[00:56:03 - 00:56:12]
It's speech, boys. Good vibration. The keyboard was programmed by musician. It's like what I was expecting. Like a keyboard. Like piano keys. 

Amanda:
[00:56:12 - 00:56:20]
Yeah. You put a little Diddy. That's the song they have to play. Actually, that's my dinner done. 

Theresa:
[00:56:21 - 00:56:22]
So. 

Amanda:
[00:56:22 - 00:56:23]
So he does it. 

Kip:
[00:56:23 - 00:56:23]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[00:56:24 - 00:56:26]
And he turns the light off and he's successful. 

Theresa:
[00:56:26 - 00:56:30]
And he immediately gets a transmission. Yeah, immediately. 

Kip:
[00:56:30 - 00:56:31]
Immediately. Like it's been trying. 

Theresa:
[00:56:32 - 00:56:32]
Yeah. 

Kip:
[00:56:33 - 00:56:35]
Benny's just sitting there like, 24 7. 

Amanda:
[00:56:36 - 00:56:39]
Can someone explain? I think. I don't really understand this piece. 

Theresa:
[00:56:39 - 00:56:40]
Which piece? 

Amanda:
[00:56:40 - 00:56:43]
Like, so why is she transmitting to the boat? 

Kip:
[00:56:43 - 00:56:56]
Because she's trying to find the island. She's trying to find Desmond. She's not transmitting to the boat. They didn't connect to the boat in that little room. She's. Remember she's got those people working in Antarctica. 

Amanda:
[00:56:56 - 00:56:56]
Yeah. 

Kip:
[00:56:56 - 00:57:30]
And then they sensed that thing. So in her cadre of scienticians working to. To find the island, somehow I assume that they were. Found a way to triangulate and. And were able to find how to connect, but just the connection wasn't happening. It's like she found the phone number. She kept calling it, but kept getting a busy signal. So it's like, try again, try again, try again. And then that's. It's just good timing, I guess, that she happened to be trying again right when Charlie shut it off. 

Amanda:
[00:57:30 - 00:57:33]
I. I loved it. I just. I think, yeah, I missed that little connection. 

Kip:
[00:57:33 - 00:57:37]
And I think we just have to infer this. Like, I don't think it's ever actually. 

Amanda:
[00:57:37 - 00:57:46]
Explained, but, yeah, it's it's good. But that. I remember getting chills. And quite honestly, I still got chills a little bit this last time when. When you hear that. 

Kip:
[00:57:46 - 00:57:48]
I know. I forgot she was in it even. 

Amanda:
[00:57:48 - 00:57:53]
Because Naomi did explicitly state she was working for her. Right? 

Kip:
[00:57:53 - 00:58:04]
Not. That's what I was trying to remember. I don't think so. Like, I don't think Naomi ever actually says she's there on behalf of Penelope Woodmore. I think she has the picture. 

Theresa:
[00:58:06 - 00:58:06]
But. 

Kip:
[00:58:06 - 00:58:07]
Or does she? 

Theresa:
[00:58:08 - 00:58:10]
I feel like she kind of has to. Because why would they. 

Kip:
[00:58:12 - 00:58:14]
Because she recognizes Desmond. 

Theresa:
[00:58:14 - 00:58:16]
And maybe they just assume and then go from there. 

Amanda:
[00:58:16 - 00:58:19]
They just assume there's a picture in her book too, right? 

Kip:
[00:58:19 - 00:58:19]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[00:58:20 - 00:58:23]
It's like, why does this woman have a picture of your girlfriend? 

Kip:
[00:58:23 - 00:58:28]
And then she says Desmond when she wakes up and sees him. Doesn't hume or whatever. 

Theresa:
[00:58:28 - 00:58:35]
You'd think they would have had a conversation about that, though. You know what I mean? Like, at some point being like, how's Penny doing? Yeah. 

Amanda:
[00:58:35 - 00:58:37]
Doesn't sew in his head. 

Kip:
[00:58:37 - 00:58:44]
Yeah, exactly. But then he sees her, though, and looks like. Just the look on his face when he sees her on the tv. 

Theresa:
[00:58:46 - 00:58:47]
He's like, running penne. 

Amanda:
[00:58:47 - 00:58:53]
I'm glad she didn't yell back, Desmond, because I think I would have collapsed into a pile of tears. 

Kip:
[00:58:53 - 00:58:54]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[00:58:54 - 00:58:54]
Does. 

Kip:
[00:58:56 - 00:59:04]
But, yeah, it's very sweet. And just like, also shocking, though, when Charlie's like, oh, are you on the boat? Are you on your boat? 

Theresa:
[00:59:05 - 00:59:05]
She's like, what? 

Kip:
[00:59:05 - 00:59:07]
Yeah. She has no idea what the. 

Theresa:
[00:59:07 - 00:59:07]
She's. 

Kip:
[00:59:07 - 00:59:11]
What he's talking about. Oh, it is not Penny's boat. 

Theresa:
[00:59:11 - 00:59:16]
But we also see that there are. Where there were three bodies. There are only two. 

Kip:
[00:59:16 - 00:59:17]
Oh, yeah. 

Theresa:
[00:59:18 - 00:59:22]
One body is missing. Where has it gone? 

Amanda:
[00:59:23 - 00:59:24]
Where are body? 

Kip:
[00:59:25 - 00:59:29]
What? What did you say? 

Amanda:
[00:59:30 - 00:59:31]
Where art thou? 

Kip:
[00:59:31 - 00:59:32]
Art thou body? 

Theresa:
[00:59:32 - 00:59:33]
Yes. One body has gone. 

Amanda:
[00:59:34 - 00:59:46]
Yeah. So as. As Charlie's piecing it all together, Mikhail and his, like, true villain era. Like, true Bond villain era. 

Kip:
[00:59:46 - 00:59:48]
It was very Bond villainous. 

Amanda:
[00:59:48 - 00:59:53]
Yeah, it totally was. He's like, knock, knock. Like, I've got a little grenady with. 

Kip:
[00:59:53 - 00:59:55]
A spoon spear through my chest. 

Theresa:
[00:59:56 - 01:00:03]
That man is borderline invincible. I would not be surprised if he showed up in season four or five. She's like, hello, I'm back, cuz he got shot. 

Amanda:
[01:00:03 - 01:00:06]
He's. No, I think he might have swam around way in time. 

Theresa:
[01:00:08 - 01:00:09]
I wouldn't be surprised if he was, like. 

Amanda:
[01:00:11 - 01:00:12]
Blown away. 

Kip:
[01:00:12 - 01:00:14]
He's also missing a hand now. 

Amanda:
[01:00:15 - 01:00:15]
Yeah. 

Kip:
[01:00:15 - 01:00:20]
He's just slowly losing body parts. But he's not dying because, like, he's. 

Theresa:
[01:00:20 - 01:00:28]
Been like, I don't know about you, but, like, sometimes when you watch movies and someone gets stabbed, like, in the abdomen or like the chest, they die pretty much instantly. 

Amanda:
[01:00:28 - 01:00:28]
Yeah. 

Theresa:
[01:00:29 - 01:00:34]
And he's. He's been speared through the chest and yet somehow finds a way to be like grenade. 

Amanda:
[01:00:34 - 01:00:40]
It really doesn't matter if it goes through, like, a major organ or artery or vein. Like, there's lots of stuff in there that actually won't kill you. 

Theresa:
[01:00:40 - 01:00:42]
I mean, is this not where your heart is? 

Kip:
[01:00:42 - 01:00:44]
Yeah, but it could miss it by even a centimeter. 

Amanda:
[01:00:44 - 01:00:49]
And that's doesn't hit an artery. It doesn't hit vein. If it goes into, like, muscle or bone or your lungs. 

Kip:
[01:00:49 - 01:00:49]
Big hook. 

Theresa:
[01:00:50 - 01:00:51]
It's crazy. 

Amanda:
[01:00:51 - 01:01:00]
It. That is one thing I've learned in recent years is that, like, sometimes people will be injured in ways that you're. Like, there is no way they survive that. 

Kip:
[01:01:00 - 01:01:00]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[01:01:00 - 01:01:05]
And then sometimes people get hit, like, once in the back of the head and they die. 

Theresa:
[01:01:05 - 01:01:06]
Oh, yeah. 

Amanda:
[01:01:06 - 01:01:16]
It's. It's really. That's why you need to everyone be kind and nice to each other and drive safely. Don't drink and drive and don't hit each other and check both ways before you should. 

Theresa:
[01:01:16 - 01:01:23]
You should tell the entire cast that because they all. Are all. All hitting each other in the face and in the head very casually to knock each other out. 

Kip:
[01:01:23 - 01:01:25]
They do love violence in this show. 

Amanda:
[01:01:25 - 01:01:28]
I think that 90 days. Did we. How. What days have they on? 

Theresa:
[01:01:28 - 01:01:29]
90 and 91. 

Amanda:
[01:01:29 - 01:01:29]
91. 

Kip:
[01:01:29 - 01:01:30]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[01:01:30 - 01:01:32]
I think we've hit our peak of patience. 

Kip:
[01:01:33 - 01:01:33]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[01:01:34 - 01:01:38]
But. But so Mikhail, all joking aside, I think we're joking because we're also all broken. 

Kip:
[01:01:39 - 01:01:53]
Well, it was. Yeah. Charlie closes the room off, protects dez, and in his final act, he warns him that Naomi's not telling the truth. 

Theresa:
[01:01:53 - 01:01:53]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[01:01:53 - 01:02:21]
And to me, like, honestly, I'm getting kind of emotional about it even now because, like, we spent a lot of time on Charlie and we talked in Greatest Hits about how, like, he's clearly come around, but this is the guy who is self indulgent. He was self centered, he was panicky, he was fearful, he was quick to temper. And in literally the most, like, moment, like, he. He had thought he had kind of gotten ahead of this. 

Kip:
[01:02:21 - 01:02:22]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[01:02:22 - 01:02:51]
And when he realizes that it's all still coming down on him, he doesn't panic, he doesn't whatever. He takes that time and watching it and having it play out where he's actually, like, trying to write on his hand in real time as the water's coming up, like, he thinks Fast enough to get Desmond to safety, he thinks. Fast enough to write that. Before it does, he shows it to. To Desmond. They have that kind of moment where their hands touch through the glass and then he pushes off and like, he kind of smiles to Desmond. Right before too. 

Kip:
[01:02:51 - 01:03:00]
Like he's just like accepted, I think, knowing. Because you're right. There was those moments where they're both kind of like, okay, you don't have to die. 

Theresa:
[01:03:00 - 01:03:02]
Yeah, no more flashes. 

Kip:
[01:03:02 - 01:03:15]
We're going to get through this and we're both leaving this together. And then it's just like he's like, okay, Actually, no, his flash was right. And this is what's gonna save everybody. So I have to go through with. 

Theresa:
[01:03:15 - 01:03:24]
It because he easily could have just been like, nope. And like just jumped out and then pulled the door shut behind him and been like, let's swim back the out. 

Kip:
[01:03:24 - 01:03:25]
Yeah. 

Theresa:
[01:03:25 - 01:03:30]
Or, you know, but he just gave into it and his like, fate. 

Kip:
[01:03:30 - 01:03:31]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[01:03:32 - 01:03:34]
Yeah. It was just beautiful. 

Kip:
[01:03:34 - 01:03:36]
Yeah. Moment of reflection for Charlie Pace. 

Amanda:
[01:03:37 - 01:03:44]
And the music changes and he. When he pushes off and does the sign of the cross and then just kind of closes his eyes like. 

Kip:
[01:03:44 - 01:03:45]
Yeah, it was very moving. 

Amanda:
[01:03:47 - 01:03:48]
Yeah. 

Kip:
[01:03:48 - 01:03:50]
Well, okay, so that's it for underwater. 

Amanda:
[01:03:50 - 01:03:51]
Underwater. 

Kip:
[01:03:51 - 01:03:53]
Now we have everything above ground. 

Theresa:
[01:03:54 - 01:03:59]
We're in the moon. Tension in the what? Moon test. 

Kip:
[01:03:59 - 01:04:03]
I know. I. I got there, but it took me a second. Are you saying moon pool again? 

Theresa:
[01:04:04 - 01:04:05]
Moon bowl. 

Kip:
[01:04:05 - 01:04:06]
No more movies. 

Amanda:
[01:04:09 - 01:04:14]
We say goodbye to the moon pool without ever fully knowing what the moon pool is or how it is in existence. 

Kip:
[01:04:14 - 01:04:26]
I don't understand moon pools. So have we talked at all about the blowing up plan yet? Other than that, Jin said and Bernard of the snapes. 

Theresa:
[01:04:27 - 01:04:27]
No. 

Kip:
[01:04:27 - 01:04:42]
Okay, so to kind of get there quickly. Basically, Ben surmises that they've been warned, but the. The walkie talkies are off because they're in hunting mode. Like the. The attackers. The guy and his ten best plush. 

Amanda:
[01:04:42 - 01:04:50]
I'm gonna be really real with you. I'm really thinking. He couldn't find his 10 best and just settled for the people closest to his campfire. 

Kip:
[01:04:50 - 01:04:55]
They weren't great, like, but I mean, they walked into a trap. 

Amanda:
[01:04:55 - 01:04:57]
Seems kind of lame, right? 

Kip:
[01:04:59 - 01:05:02]
Walked into a trap. And. And Ben couldn't warn them because their walkies were off. 

Theresa:
[01:05:03 - 01:05:16]
And we get one pew. Saeed, you get second pew. Bernard. Then we get one pew nothing. Second pew nothing. They're in the true line. 

Amanda:
[01:05:17 - 01:05:21]
Good reenactment. We should start a lost reenactment club. 

Kip:
[01:05:22 - 01:05:24]
One pill, two pill. 

Amanda:
[01:05:24 - 01:05:31]
But I pre watching it and I kind of said I'm like, oh, Jin, come on. Kind of thing. And keeps like, well, he has a handgun. 

Kip:
[01:05:32 - 01:05:34]
The other two have full on rifles. 

Amanda:
[01:05:34 - 01:05:37]
Oh, yeah. That does seem kind of unfair. 

Kip:
[01:05:38 - 01:05:40]
I don't know. I've never. Well, I have shot a handgun. 

Amanda:
[01:05:40 - 01:05:41]
Yeah. 

Kip:
[01:05:41 - 01:05:46]
In a shooting range. But like, I've never tried to aim one. I imagine it's a lot more difficult than aiming a rifle. 

Theresa:
[01:05:47 - 01:05:48]
I think it is too. 

Amanda:
[01:05:48 - 01:05:49]
I don't know. 

Theresa:
[01:05:49 - 01:05:50]
I've shot a rifle. 

Amanda:
[01:05:50 - 01:05:51]
I've only ever shot a handgun. 

Theresa:
[01:05:51 - 01:05:55]
I've only ever shot rifles and it. On my stomach. 

Kip:
[01:05:56 - 01:05:59]
You were on your stomach, cadets. 

Theresa:
[01:05:59 - 01:05:59]
Yeah. 

Kip:
[01:05:59 - 01:06:00]
Right, right, right. Yeah. 

Amanda:
[01:06:00 - 01:06:03]
I shot at a piece of paper in the shape of a zombie. 

Theresa:
[01:06:05 - 01:06:09]
Yeah. It's a little different, I'd say. I don't know. I've never shot a handgun, so they're. 

Amanda:
[01:06:09 - 01:06:10]
Not as easy to play. 

Kip:
[01:06:10 - 01:06:13]
Jen. Yeah. Mrs. And unfortunately gives away their. 

Theresa:
[01:06:14 - 01:06:14]
That they're in the tree. 

Amanda:
[01:06:14 - 01:06:19]
But holy heck, did they take out some people before that. I was like, this is getting serious. 

Theresa:
[01:06:19 - 01:06:20]
They took out seven. 

Kip:
[01:06:20 - 01:06:40]
Seven. And then the. The truckers see the two explosions and they know something is amiss and it is tragic. And I love Rose's line to Jack. He's trying to reassure them and tell them it's okay. We're gonna check on Jack. I swear to God, if you tell me, if you say lift together, die alone one more time, I'm gonna punch you. 

Amanda:
[01:06:40 - 01:06:42]
And I love how he's just like, fair enough. 

Kip:
[01:06:42 - 01:06:43]
Yeah, exactly. 

Amanda:
[01:06:43 - 01:06:46]
That is what you would say in real life. Like, okay, you're right. 

Kip:
[01:06:47 - 01:06:50]
So, I mean, they're. They know something's gone wrong, but they don't know what. 

Amanda:
[01:06:51 - 01:06:54]
But you know what? I really want to talk as we talked about Charlie's growth. Right. 

Kip:
[01:06:54 - 01:06:55]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[01:06:55 - 01:07:08]
And because you were saying, Teresa too, about the contrast between island and off island, I really think we need to, as we go along here, point out. I'm. I think we should. I'm going to point out ways I think that Jack has grown. 

Kip:
[01:07:08 - 01:07:08]
Okay. 

Amanda:
[01:07:08 - 01:07:20]
Because Jack, season one. Jack would be like, I have to be there. I'll be back. You guys are fine. I'm gonna go save Saeed, Bernard and Jin. And I'm going to also set the fire, go back 20 minutes in time, and this will never have happened. 

Kip:
[01:07:20 - 01:07:21]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[01:07:21 - 01:07:32]
But he. He knows, like, he is like, so set on like, no, I'm gonna get you guys off this island. This is how we're gonna do it. We have to step forward. And this is the first moment of that in my mind. We're gonna see many. 

Kip:
[01:07:33 - 01:07:33]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[01:07:33 - 01:07:39]
But this was, I think, the first one where he's like, no, Rose, son, like, we have to keep moving forward. 

Kip:
[01:07:39 - 01:07:40]
All of us together. 

Amanda:
[01:07:40 - 01:07:41]
Probably fine. 

Kip:
[01:07:43 - 01:07:47]
I agree. Because, like, he would have wanted to run back and. And take care of it himself, right? 

Theresa:
[01:07:47 - 01:07:50]
Oh, totally. Especially because Russo's leading. He doesn't know where he's going. 

Kip:
[01:07:51 - 01:07:52]
Well, that's right. Yeah. 

Theresa:
[01:07:52 - 01:07:55]
Right. Like, Russo's the one who's like, I've been here one time. 

Amanda:
[01:07:55 - 01:07:58]
Like, he could totally be like, oh, Russo. Oh, you guys go ahead. I'll catch up. 

Kip:
[01:07:59 - 01:08:00]
I've been here one time. 

Amanda:
[01:08:00 - 01:08:01]
Yeah. 

Kip:
[01:08:01 - 01:08:04]
She's my favorite character, but she knows where she's going. 

Theresa:
[01:08:04 - 01:08:07]
She does know where she goes. She's been out. She's been on the island for 16 years. 

Kip:
[01:08:07 - 01:08:10]
She's probably seen it several times. She hasn't gone inside. 

Theresa:
[01:08:10 - 01:08:13]
She's like, there it is again, still playing I. 

Kip:
[01:08:13 - 01:08:18]
There one time. Yes. Russo's leading the crew. Jack's just making sure everyone sticks together. 

Amanda:
[01:08:18 - 01:08:20]
Yeah. And. And doing a good job. 

Kip:
[01:08:20 - 01:08:21]
Yeah. He's leading. 

Amanda:
[01:08:21 - 01:08:26]
Letting them sidewind, even in a pretty emotional however. 

Kip:
[01:08:28 - 01:08:36]
Oh, we will get there eventually. But him and everyone else don't even notice that Earthy's left. 

Theresa:
[01:08:37 - 01:08:39]
Yeah. That is a problem. Like, that's an issue. 

Kip:
[01:08:40 - 01:08:41]
There's a gap. 

Amanda:
[01:08:41 - 01:08:42]
Everyone needs a buddy. 

Kip:
[01:08:42 - 01:08:52]
We need a buddy system here because we're calls on. I mean, we're getting way ahead, but. Yeah. So Jack leading everybody, doing a great job, missing out on his head counts. 

Amanda:
[01:08:52 - 01:08:52]
Yeah. 

Kip:
[01:08:52 - 01:08:53]
Yeah, eventually. 

Theresa:
[01:08:53 - 01:09:01]
So then the. I mean, no, I'm sure nobody was, like, shocked by Kate saying that they need to go back. 

Kip:
[01:09:02 - 01:09:02]
Yeah. 

Theresa:
[01:09:02 - 01:09:04]
When they're filling up their water bottles. 

Kip:
[01:09:04 - 01:09:27]
So we talked about at the very beginning how there's no nicknames from Sawyer today. These two days. He's very serious. And I kind of forgot until she said, ever since you got that tape from Locke, you've been in this mood. And I kind of forgot that he killed it. He killed that man. 

Amanda:
[01:09:27 - 01:09:28]
Yeah. 

Kip:
[01:09:28 - 01:09:51]
And then I remember us saying at. In that episode, like, the trauma that that would have caused him, because he was not okay with how it happened. He was conned. And it was just. I think it was nice to see that they. They have actually kept that up. That. Yeah. He has been in a mood since then. He's been distraught. He's working through that, and he's serious. Sawyer. 

Theresa:
[01:09:51 - 01:09:51]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[01:09:51 - 01:10:06]
Because he choked a man to death after, like. And. And not only, like, this time, for better or worse, like, it was the man he spent. So I think his trauma is being played really well. Because I think his trauma would actually be twofold. 

Kip:
[01:10:06 - 01:10:06]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[01:10:06 - 01:10:26]
Like it's kind of like, you know how they say never meet your heroes? Like I think spending your whole life. And he's like a 40 year old man chasing this like climactic closure scene that you've been searching for and having it happen in that way like that alone. Whether or not he actually killed him or. 

Kip:
[01:10:26 - 01:10:27]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[01:10:27 - 01:10:39]
Anthony Cooper walked away or was like, I'm so sorry for everything. No matter what the end result was going to be, that was going to be essentially a lifelong goal finally coming come to fruition. 

Theresa:
[01:10:39 - 01:10:40]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[01:10:40 - 01:10:45]
And then on top of it, it happens in a way that like you said, Kip, he's conned. So it's not by choice. 

Kip:
[01:10:45 - 01:10:45]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[01:10:45 - 01:10:54]
And he, you know, he's not a bad guy. So taking a life, although he has done it, is not as easy for him as I think people think. 

Kip:
[01:10:54 - 01:10:55]
I agree. 

Amanda:
[01:10:55 - 01:10:57]
So it's a lot. 

Kip:
[01:10:57 - 01:11:14]
It is a lot. And just like Kate recognizing it too, being like you've been in a mood basically like what's going on? And he's just like anti Kate in that moment. And do you believe Jack when he said he's doing it to protect you or do you think he's just processing things? 

Amanda:
[01:11:14 - 01:11:18]
And I think like when, when. So when Sawyer says I'm going to go back. 

Kip:
[01:11:18 - 01:11:18]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[01:11:18 - 01:11:38]
And that scene is kind of interesting cuz he. Yeah, he's going to go back and then Juliet agrees to go with him as well. And we'll have to talk about that scene a bit because there's some good stuff there. But I don't know. Like I do, I do think it was to protect her. 

Kip:
[01:11:38 - 01:11:38]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[01:11:39 - 01:11:50]
I think maybe he would have done it a little bit differently if he was in a better headspace. Because I don't really think he's communicating very effectively at all. Like even when he's later on with Juliet, like he's not as clever and like. 

Kip:
[01:11:50 - 01:11:51]
No. 

Amanda:
[01:11:51 - 01:12:09]
You know, as he would be. Right. But I, I do think he wants to protect her. I think he also just like I'm not sure that he really wants to be with her right now. Like, I think there's a lot of complex emotions around her and like what they're doing and how he feels about her. 

Kip:
[01:12:09 - 01:12:12]
Well, as he says in season one, I'm a complex guy, sweetheart. 

Amanda:
[01:12:12 - 01:12:14]
Yeah, he is a complicated guy. 

Kip:
[01:12:14 - 01:12:25]
You know. So like you're right. I think he's just. Yeah. Because I was confused until Jackson said that. Like, well, he's just doing it to protect you. I'm like, oh, yeah, I guess that makes sense. 

Amanda:
[01:12:25 - 01:13:24]
I. I do think that, like, I don't think he wants her to be hurt, but, yeah, when. And then Juliet says, oh, I know where there's guns. We'll go get guns. And then they agree to go together. And then Juliet and Jack have the cutest little interaction that she. He says, don't do anything stupid. And she says, I won't if you won't. And to me, that just kind of, like, spoke to, like, how? Well, like, they're an interesting kind of duo. Because, like, when Naomi wants to explain to him how to use the phone, for example, and she's with him, and Naomi wants her gone, and she goes to leave, and he's like, oh, you can stay, like, whatever. Like, he seems to trust Juliet so much. They seem to get each other so much, even though, like, he did get lied to by her for the first couple days she was with them, too. But he trusts her so deeply, and they have this cute little, like, exchange that's very on brand for both of them. And then she kisses him. 

Kip:
[01:13:24 - 01:13:24]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[01:13:24 - 01:13:34]
And I do think it's important to note, because you did this when we're watching, because Teresa's like, kiss, kiss. Yeah, you guys, it was so weird. She's like, kiss. Kiss her, Jack. 

Theresa:
[01:13:35 - 01:13:36]
Like a kiss moment. 

Amanda:
[01:13:37 - 01:13:39]
And then they kiss, and Juice is like, yay. 

Theresa:
[01:13:41 - 01:13:41]
That's not what I sound like. 

Amanda:
[01:13:41 - 01:13:59]
Yeah, it is. And then Kips says, well, I think technically she kissed him. And we're kind of, like, being, like, all jokey about it, but I think it's important that that is what happened. Like, he did not kiss her because I think his feelings for her are still a lot more complicated. 

Kip:
[01:13:59 - 01:14:11]
Yeah. I think they're not quite that romantic. Like, I think he's maybe wanting it to be, but he just can't, because he's not over Kate. He still loves Kate. And he tells her literally in that. 

Amanda:
[01:14:12 - 01:14:17]
And that's another way. Point number two of Jack's growth. 

Kip:
[01:14:17 - 01:14:17]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[01:14:17 - 01:14:41]
But on the Amanda scale, he does that. He says, you know, this was to protect you, blah, blah, blah, blah. And she says, why are you defending him anyway? Or just pick it up for him anyway. And normally I think he'd say something like, because he. Like I was expecting him to say, or because she says specifically, why are you doing this? He wouldn't do it for you. And I honestly, like, sometimes when I watch TV shows, I don't know if you guys do this, but I, like, fill in what I think is going to come. 

Kip:
[01:14:41 - 01:14:41]
Oh, of Course. 

Amanda:
[01:14:41 - 01:14:52]
So in my mind, I was like, he's going to say something like, well, that's why I do it, because I'm better than him. Or I do it because I know he wouldn't do it. And he just looks at her. He's like, because I love you. And I remember being like, what? 

Kip:
[01:14:52 - 01:14:54]
So direct, so honest. 

Amanda:
[01:14:55 - 01:14:57]
So direct. So simple. 

Kip:
[01:14:57 - 01:14:58]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[01:14:58 - 01:15:01]
And it's exactly the right answer. 

Kip:
[01:15:01 - 01:15:02]
Yeah, exactly. 

Amanda:
[01:15:02 - 01:15:08]
He did it. He's doing it because he absolutely loves her. It's that simple. And he just wants her to be happy. 

Kip:
[01:15:08 - 01:15:08]
He. 

Amanda:
[01:15:08 - 01:15:11]
He wants her to feel good. He doesn't want her to feel bad about something that was done to her. 

Kip:
[01:15:11 - 01:15:12]
Exactly. 

Amanda:
[01:15:12 - 01:15:21]
Even if it's not with him or because of him. Like, he'll take the time to like, explain how someone was speaking to her so she doesn't feel bad. 

Kip:
[01:15:21 - 01:15:36]
Bad, I thought he was gonna say as a callback to season one, when Sawyer says, well, Doc, because you're about the closest thing on this island I have to a friend, I thought he was gonna say something like that about Sawyer, but then I'm like, well, I guess he would say say that to Sawyer, not Kate. 

Amanda:
[01:15:36 - 01:15:38]
Yeah, well, he could have said, kate. 

Kip:
[01:15:38 - 01:15:39]
Doesn'T care if they're friends. 

Theresa:
[01:15:40 - 01:15:41]
She would prefer that they want. 

Amanda:
[01:15:41 - 01:15:44]
But he could have said, still, like, cuz he's the closest thing I have to. 

Kip:
[01:15:44 - 01:15:48]
That's what I thought he was going. But. But yeah, that. That is a great scene. 

Amanda:
[01:15:49 - 01:15:50]
Oh, it's beautiful. 

Kip:
[01:15:50 - 01:16:06]
Between all of them, he's growing. So. Yeah. Sawyer and Juliet. And this is sort of the. The beginning of Joyer, Suliette, Sawyer at. What are they? 

Amanda:
[01:16:12 - 01:16:38]
I like Joyer, I think Joyer, Suliette. I actually made a note this exact moment that said. Okay, I'll be verbatim because this is how I felt during the episode. Knowing what's coming in season four and seeing the seeds of how we get there planted is so satisfying. Like Sawyer deciding to go back for gin and them and Juliet offering to get the guns of Sawyer is just laying the seeds for all of these, like, intense relationships in season four and five. 

Kip:
[01:16:38 - 01:16:38]
Yes. 

Theresa:
[01:16:38 - 01:16:40]
Heck yeah, brother. 

Kip:
[01:16:41 - 01:16:42]
No, it's true. 

Amanda:
[01:16:42 - 01:16:47]
And then the worst part was I was like, how does Hurley get involved in all this? And then it happens. 

Kip:
[01:16:47 - 01:16:48]
Then it happens. 

Amanda:
[01:16:48 - 01:16:49]
Yeah. 

Kip:
[01:16:51 - 01:16:52]
Poor Hurley. 

Amanda:
[01:16:53 - 01:16:54]
Oh my God. 

Theresa:
[01:16:54 - 01:16:54]
Again. 

Kip:
[01:16:54 - 01:16:59]
I mean, I. Like you said, Teresa. I understand why they're. They're doing it to protect him. 

Theresa:
[01:16:59 - 01:17:01]
Yeah. It's not nice, though. 

Kip:
[01:17:01 - 01:17:03]
It's not nice why they had to. 

Amanda:
[01:17:03 - 01:17:03]
Do it so meanly. 

Kip:
[01:17:03 - 01:17:04]
I know. 

Amanda:
[01:17:04 - 01:17:14]
And you can tell like when Sawyer did that. That and Juliet kind of looked back at him that she's like, she feels so bad for him, but, like, she's also like, I don't have skin in this game. Like, I don't know how to talk to any of these people. 

Kip:
[01:17:15 - 01:17:20]
Yeah. I just. I wish the writers would have thought of other ways to, like, get that point across. 

Amanda:
[01:17:21 - 01:17:22]
Yeah. 

Kip:
[01:17:22 - 01:17:26]
There are plenty of ways. It doesn't have to be just a knock on his weight. 

Amanda:
[01:17:26 - 01:17:27]
I know. 

Theresa:
[01:17:27 - 01:17:29]
Yeah. It could be like, you don't know how to. 

Kip:
[01:17:29 - 01:17:32]
We're tracking. You just said you're sick of tracking. 

Theresa:
[01:17:32 - 01:17:33]
Yeah. Trek that way. 

Amanda:
[01:17:33 - 01:17:37]
Yeah. Or you, you know, like, you don't have any experience with guns, like. 

Theresa:
[01:17:37 - 01:17:37]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[01:17:37 - 01:17:39]
You know, or fighting, like. 

Kip:
[01:17:39 - 01:17:45]
Exactly. Like, there could have been many other ways, but anyway, he walks away sadly. 

Amanda:
[01:17:45 - 01:17:53]
It's so sad watching him get dejected by both Charlie and then Sawyer was hard. 

Kip:
[01:17:53 - 01:17:54]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[01:17:54 - 01:17:59]
I just might. I got that, like, sinking, like, chest feeling you get when you just watch other people get bullied. 

Kip:
[01:17:59 - 01:18:00]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[01:18:00 - 01:18:03]
I'm just like, oh, someone. He's so sweet. He just wants to help. 

Kip:
[01:18:03 - 01:18:03]
I know. 

Amanda:
[01:18:04 - 01:18:05]
There's no way for him to help. Really? 

Kip:
[01:18:06 - 01:18:09]
Yeah. Like, yeah. So it's rough. 

Theresa:
[01:18:10 - 01:18:11]
It's so rough. 

Kip:
[01:18:12 - 01:18:20]
And what happens next? Do we get. Are we at the beach again or. Or. No, I think they. I think we kind of skipped over Ben and Alex. 

Amanda:
[01:18:21 - 01:18:22]
Yeah. 

Kip:
[01:18:22 - 01:18:23]
Deciding to come meet. 

Amanda:
[01:18:23 - 01:18:31]
Yeah. But that's important, right? Because that scene between them is such a dick. So awkward. 

Kip:
[01:18:31 - 01:18:31]
Holy. 

Amanda:
[01:18:32 - 01:18:40]
But I actually think there's something important in that scene too. That kind of. I realized a little bit, like, it's hard to tell what he's feeling towards Alex right now. Like, what do you guys think? 

Kip:
[01:18:41 - 01:19:02]
Well, like, I mean, he. When he's getting ready to go and meet them, we'll quickly say. Because I think it's a. Interesting Ben ism that Richard's basically saying, what are you going to do? You're. There's 40 of them. There's one of you. He's like, I'll do what I do best. I'll talk them out of it. I'm like, that is such a good Ben line. 

Theresa:
[01:19:02 - 01:19:02]
Oh, 100%. 

Kip:
[01:19:02 - 01:19:04]
Cuz, like, that is what he does. 

Amanda:
[01:19:04 - 01:19:05]
That's all he can do. Really? 

Kip:
[01:19:05 - 01:19:08]
Yeah. He. He can talk. Talk people into doing what he wants them to do. 

Theresa:
[01:19:08 - 01:19:09]
That's literally it. Yeah. 

Kip:
[01:19:09 - 01:19:10]
I love that. 

Amanda:
[01:19:10 - 01:19:11]
Yeah. 

Kip:
[01:19:11 - 01:19:22]
And then Alex is sort of like up in his face, like, well, just come with me. And then they go. And she's kind of like, oh, okay, sure. So. But then I think the scene you're talking about is where they're at the rock. 

Amanda:
[01:19:22 - 01:19:22]
Yeah. 

Kip:
[01:19:22 - 01:19:26]
And she asks a good question. Why can't you just let them leave? 

Amanda:
[01:19:26 - 01:19:27]
Yeah. 

Theresa:
[01:19:27 - 01:19:29]
And he doesn't even give a good answer. 

Amanda:
[01:19:29 - 01:19:31]
He says, because I can't. 

Kip:
[01:19:31 - 01:19:32]
Yeah, that's it. 

Amanda:
[01:19:32 - 01:19:36]
And it's so interesting because why can't he. 

Kip:
[01:19:36 - 01:19:37]
I know. 

Amanda:
[01:19:37 - 01:19:51]
Like, what at this point. Do we see in any way of, like, an actual tactile, like, motive here that makes sense at this point, other than like. Like, if it was. Like, we need. If it's just. Is it the women thing? Is it the pregnant women thing? 

Kip:
[01:19:51 - 01:20:19]
All I can think of is going back to what he said about the sub. If people start leaving through ways that he doesn't control, then all the people he's quote, unquote, collected. I'm thinking, like Cindy, for example, who's now drank the Kool Aid. And is there. Are they going to start questioning. Oh, well, then I'd like to go too. You know, are people just going to. Is that maybe his thinking. I can't let people leave unless I'm the one allowing them to leave. 

Amanda:
[01:20:19 - 01:20:20]
Yeah. 

Kip:
[01:20:20 - 01:20:30]
If they leave via this freighter, that's not his control. So I. I think it's. He can't let them leave unless he is the one planning it, executing it. 

Amanda:
[01:20:30 - 01:20:31]
And I mean, that makes sense. 

Kip:
[01:20:31 - 01:20:32]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[01:20:32 - 01:20:55]
Right. Like, that is actually quite. Yeah. I think that might be partially what it is for sure. Like, but the. What sucks is because he's losing such a grasp on reality here is he's losing that control by the way he's going about this stuff. Because, like, as much as. Yeah. You don't want them to leave or whatever, now all of your kind of like, webs are coming untangled. 

Kip:
[01:20:55 - 01:20:55]
Exactly. 

Amanda:
[01:20:55 - 01:21:00]
And people are starting to really. And people, like I said, like Richard. Right. So. 

Kip:
[01:21:00 - 01:21:02]
And Tom earlier, because he didn't help him. 

Amanda:
[01:21:03 - 01:21:03]
Yeah. 

Kip:
[01:21:03 - 01:21:07]
In the future anyway. But then the Alex scene with him. 

Amanda:
[01:21:08 - 01:21:17]
It'S actually kind of an interesting scene too, because he's like. He says to her, like, straight up, like, you betrayed me. And I. I'm still not 100 sure, like, what his. 

Kip:
[01:21:17 - 01:21:17]
Him. 

Amanda:
[01:21:17 - 01:21:23]
What his plan is with her here. Like, and when he says as much as, like, you know, I'm gonna leave you with your new family or whatever. 

Kip:
[01:21:23 - 01:21:24]
Oh, my God. 

Amanda:
[01:21:24 - 01:21:29]
Is that true? Or is he trying to. Like, it's hard to say with him, but obviously he does feel betrayed by her. 

Theresa:
[01:21:29 - 01:21:30]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[01:21:30 - 01:21:54]
And then she says, like, well, you locked Carl in a cage, you tried to brainwash him and all this stuff that sounds really screwed up. And then he says, very simply, he's like, I was trying to make sure he didn't get you pregnant. And when I first thought it, I was like, oh, my God. And, like, rolled my eyes. But as I was doing that, I'm like, okay, this isn't like the 1950s in, like, Washington, D.C. getting pregnant on this island would kill her. 

Kip:
[01:21:54 - 01:21:55]
It's a death sentence. 

Theresa:
[01:21:55 - 01:21:55]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[01:21:55 - 01:22:09]
Right. So it's like there was a part of me that was like, is this similar to the I love you moment with Jack where he's just actually finally saying the truth of his fear, like an actual real motivation for him, which, because he's screwed up, went way too far. 

Kip:
[01:22:10 - 01:22:10]
But that's. What. 

Amanda:
[01:22:10 - 01:22:12]
Is that the case is. 

Kip:
[01:22:12 - 01:22:21]
The second part of that line is when he says, I guess I overreacted. I didn't want him to get you pregnant. I guess I overreacted. 

Amanda:
[01:22:21 - 01:22:24]
But I believe that that actually might have been, like. 

Kip:
[01:22:24 - 01:22:25]
I think so too. 

Amanda:
[01:22:25 - 01:22:26]
Father reaction. 

Kip:
[01:22:26 - 01:22:34]
Absolutely. He didn't want her to die. So there's, like, some sick idea of how he love. How much he loves Alex. 

Amanda:
[01:22:34 - 01:22:35]
Yes. 

Kip:
[01:22:35 - 01:22:45]
And. But he's torturing and kidnapping and. And brainwashing her boyfriend so that she doesn't get pregnant and die. 

Amanda:
[01:22:45 - 01:22:45]
Yeah. 

Kip:
[01:22:45 - 01:22:48]
So it. Yeah, he's a little overreacting. 

Theresa:
[01:22:48 - 01:22:51]
Yeah. He's talking about it in a very weird way. 

Amanda:
[01:22:51 - 01:23:07]
But I don't know. I. There was, like. It kind of hit me. I'd never really given. Because. Because so much of Ben's motivations are either really, really nuanced or shaded or that I was like. When he said that, it was like, oh, that's, like, refreshingly honest. Honest. 

Kip:
[01:23:07 - 01:23:08]
I agree. Yeah. I agree. 

Amanda:
[01:23:09 - 01:23:10]
Kind of vulnerable. 

Kip:
[01:23:10 - 01:23:11]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[01:23:11 - 01:23:13]
Like. I don't know. I kind of liked it. 

Kip:
[01:23:13 - 01:23:21]
I did, too. It was a nice moment, and it was a. It was a good. Because all we. Oh, especially these last few episodes, all we've seen of Ben is just, like, this villain. 

Amanda:
[01:23:21 - 01:23:21]
Yeah. 

Kip:
[01:23:21 - 01:23:30]
So it was so nice to see some humanity in him and just like, okay, he is capable of love, and he is capable of actually caring for someone. 

Theresa:
[01:23:30 - 01:23:31]
Yeah. 

Kip:
[01:23:31 - 01:23:31]
Just. 

Theresa:
[01:23:31 - 01:23:33]
Just a hint of a spark. 

Kip:
[01:23:35 - 01:23:36]
So. Yeah. And then. 

Amanda:
[01:23:36 - 01:23:40]
Then they're gonna coalesce together now, like, as they're kind of approaching. 

Kip:
[01:23:40 - 01:23:48]
Because as we saw Ben draw on his map, a straight line here and a straight line there. And if we both straight line together, X circle, this is where we will meet. 

Theresa:
[01:23:48 - 01:23:56]
Yeah, we should meet them. I'm like, I really. I really hope that's the way they're going. And that they haven't made a little detour somewhere else. 

Amanda:
[01:23:57 - 01:24:06]
But that was like, quite again. Like, it kind of like rise in my chest happen. When they're walking and they come across Alex and Ben, what's gonna happen? 

Kip:
[01:24:06 - 01:24:07]
That was wild. 

Theresa:
[01:24:08 - 01:24:11]
Like, Jack's gonna kill Ben. And then all you see is Kate. 

Amanda:
[01:24:11 - 01:24:14]
Walking in the background and then running behind them again. 

Kip:
[01:24:14 - 01:24:15]
I love that. Yeah. 

Amanda:
[01:24:15 - 01:24:17]
I was like, oh, Kate, what are you doing? 

Kip:
[01:24:17 - 01:24:19]
And then she's like, they're alone. Oh, she's tracking. 

Theresa:
[01:24:19 - 01:24:19]
Yeah. 

Kip:
[01:24:19 - 01:24:20]
Yeah. She's doing Kate things. Yeah. 

Theresa:
[01:24:20 - 01:24:30]
But like, not in a way that's like. Like, it's like, very obvious. Like, it's not stealthy or anything. Like, she just kind of. Just kind of weird, like, hop block all the way around. 

Kip:
[01:24:30 - 01:24:43]
Funny. And I. I love, though, when Ben goes to talk to Naomi and Jackson's like, don't talk to him. Do not talk to him. Like, I just. I love Jack in these moments. I love this vengeful, angry, just pissed off Jack. 

Amanda:
[01:24:43 - 01:24:44]
He's like. He doesn't get talked to. 

Kip:
[01:24:44 - 01:24:46]
Yeah. I just loved it. 

Amanda:
[01:24:47 - 01:25:08]
Well, we're coming up on, I think, what is point number three of Jack's growth in this episode, which is going to sound a little backwards to those who maybe haven't watched the episodes or know the. So I know we have some listeners that don't actually know the show that well. It's going to sound terrible when I say that the growth of letting Jin, Saeed, and Bernard die is growth. 

Kip:
[01:25:08 - 01:25:10]
I know what you mean, but it is. 

Theresa:
[01:25:10 - 01:25:10]
It is growth. 

Amanda:
[01:25:11 - 01:25:16]
It is growth. I was like, I. I was on the edge of my sheet, my seat. 

Kip:
[01:25:16 - 01:25:31]
And it has to do with Said's conversation with him when they shook hands and. And Saeed saying, I'm willing to die if it gets you off this island. And that, like, just vulcanized Jack. 

Amanda:
[01:25:31 - 01:25:43]
Well, it's a lead in from the last episode or the last conversation they had where he said, like, I'm gonna stay behind and say. It's like, no, you're not. I'm gonna stay behind. You're gonna walk them to the. The tower because it's time for you to actually. 

Theresa:
[01:25:43 - 01:25:44]
Feet. 

Kip:
[01:25:44 - 01:25:45]
Exactly. 

Amanda:
[01:25:45 - 01:25:48]
Right. And he has really taken that to heart. 

Kip:
[01:25:48 - 01:25:48]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[01:25:50 - 01:26:07]
But that scene, first of all, Ben is. Is really good. So Ben tries to just convince him, you can't go. You can't go. Whatever. Right. And then essentially there's a part, though, where I can't remember exactly how the conversation. Maybe one of you guys does, but Jack says something about, like, what does he say? 

Theresa:
[01:26:08 - 01:26:09]
I don't know. 

Kip:
[01:26:09 - 01:26:10]
Are you talking about when it's just him and Ben? 

Amanda:
[01:26:10 - 01:26:27]
Yeah. And he says something about like. And that's. Oh, he's like, I'm going to kill them or whatever if you don't do what I want. And then he's like, what's to stop me from killing them? And he's like, if you don't hear from me for one minute. And the. Jack's like, rats. Felt like whoever's editing it cut out all the lead up to that. Other than that. 

Kip:
[01:26:27 - 01:26:29]
That was so funny. I had Jack's. He's like, oh, dang it. 

Amanda:
[01:26:29 - 01:26:32]
Like, he's like, I. My has been foiled. I gave him away. 

Kip:
[01:26:32 - 01:26:33]
I love that. 

Amanda:
[01:26:33 - 01:26:42]
Like, I just laughed because it reminded me of, like, exactly that. Like, Jack had maybe the best of him for a second. And he's like, well, what about this? And he's like, oh, well, I'll just take care of that. He's like, gosh darn it. 

Kip:
[01:26:42 - 01:26:44]
Yeah, exactly. It was so funny. 

Amanda:
[01:26:44 - 01:26:46]
That scene's. That's so intense, though. 

Theresa:
[01:26:46 - 01:26:50]
Oh, so, so intense. He's like, 40 seconds, 20 seconds, 10 seconds. 

Kip:
[01:26:50 - 01:26:54]
I liked your stream. Really? He can't do it in a minute, Ben. He needs longer. 

Theresa:
[01:26:54 - 01:26:59]
Well, he does. That's not enough time to go all the way back there, get the phone, and then come all the way back. 

Amanda:
[01:26:59 - 01:27:03]
But I think if she. He had just even said, like, I'll do it. Yes, but that scene. 

Theresa:
[01:27:04 - 01:27:11]
I do not believe that man was counting down. You know, that man. He would have been like, jack, not quick enough. I'll take the phone. But they're still dead. 

Amanda:
[01:27:11 - 01:27:54]
Yeah, but that scene is very interesting because it's this mind game, right? And this kind of like, you know, calling of the bluff in a sense. Right. Like, they're both trying to call each other's bluff. And it's very reminiscent of. Well, it wouldn't have been reminiscent if you're watching it for this time, but a scene later on in the series involving Ben being tasked with making a similar decision regarding something he cares about. And the way that plays out is very interesting to me because you would think Ben would. Ben has. Is the king of putting people in these situations. Right. And so he puts Jack in the situation because he doesn't know that Tom and them aren't gonna. Or does he? I'm also kind of confused about how that played out. 

Kip:
[01:27:54 - 01:27:59]
So, two questions. Because Ben tells Jack, Naomi's not who she says she is. 

Amanda:
[01:27:59 - 01:27:59]
The. 

Kip:
[01:28:00 - 01:28:27]
She works for a very dangerous man or company or organization, whatever. How does he know this? Like, is he just assuming? Because, like, we know who he's talking about, but we haven't been led to believe that he knows because he was as surprised as they were to hear this woman parachuted in. So clearly he's not aware of the freighter either. Yeah, at least an episode or two ago, but. So have they just done some homework? That's what I don't understand. 

Amanda:
[01:28:27 - 01:28:40]
I think. And I think that, like, I'm not sure he's. His surprise is so much about the existence of it or the fact that there is this kind of circling the drain. As much as I think he's surprised. 

Kip:
[01:28:40 - 01:28:42]
That they got there, that it's just, like, right now happened. 

Amanda:
[01:28:42 - 01:28:43]
Yeah. 

Kip:
[01:28:43 - 01:28:44]
Like, so soon. Almost. 

Amanda:
[01:28:44 - 01:28:44]
Yeah. 

Kip:
[01:28:44 - 01:28:45]
Yeah, that could be. 

Amanda:
[01:28:45 - 01:28:49]
I. That's how I kind of took it was more like, he knows about this. Shadiness. 

Kip:
[01:28:49 - 01:28:50]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[01:28:50 - 01:28:55]
And their desire. Because when we. What we eventually will find out is this has been a bit of a cat and mouse game. 

Kip:
[01:28:55 - 01:28:56]
Yeah, that's true. 

Amanda:
[01:28:56 - 01:28:59]
Right. For these individual players. 

Kip:
[01:29:00 - 01:29:22]
So. So that's all. And then the second question was, I don't understand either if Ben instructed them not to kill Saeed, Bernard and Jin somehow, or if it was. What's the guy's name? Not Tom, the other Ryan. If Ryan was just. Because doesn't Ryan say something like, ben's lost control. He's not. But Tom was wanting them to be actually dead. 

Amanda:
[01:29:22 - 01:29:24]
We should have shot them instead of shooting into the ground. 

Kip:
[01:29:25 - 01:29:30]
So I think it was right. Ryan made that decision, made that call. I don't think Ben. I think Ben was assuming they would be. 

Amanda:
[01:29:30 - 01:29:43]
But then I. I'm confused as to why Ryan would. Like, it's one thing. Maybe they're just not actually all killers like Ben. Maybe that's it. But why Ryan wouldn't just still follow the order, like, they don't mean anything to him. 

Kip:
[01:29:43 - 01:29:47]
Yeah, I don't know. I did. That scene didn't quite compute for me. 

Theresa:
[01:29:47 - 01:29:48]
No, me neither. 

Amanda:
[01:29:48 - 01:29:59]
I can imagine Ryan is unhappy based on the conversation he had with Ben and also knowing that, like, Juliet must have betrayed them. Right. 

Theresa:
[01:29:59 - 01:29:59]
Well. 

Kip:
[01:29:59 - 01:30:12]
And then I think it's through the con conversations. Ryan's probably hearing about how Ben lied about the station and all these things, so maybe, like, that's starting to come out too. And just. He's like, Ben's losing it. I'm not letting him tell me to. 

Theresa:
[01:30:12 - 01:30:19]
Kill three people when, like, what's happening? So, no, they just shoot to the ground. 

Kip:
[01:30:19 - 01:30:25]
And we. We. We're not sure if. If Ben orchestrated that, which we don't think he did. We think he was wanting them dead. 

Amanda:
[01:30:25 - 01:30:44]
He's on a killing because Bernard, like, we. I don't know if we really touched on it, but Bernard kind of, like, spills the beans. Yeah. He just tells everything that happened, literally. Like, it's good to not let your friend die, but, like, come on, a few things could be kept closer to the chest, you know, like, everything. He, like, sung like a canary or. 

Theresa:
[01:30:44 - 01:30:52]
Whatever minute when he goes. A kid told us that. That they were coming. Like, what kid? He's like, carl. 

Amanda:
[01:30:52 - 01:31:04]
Damn it, Bernard. So like you said, though, this is like, as this is coming out, like, Ryan and Tom are hearing all this for the first time, too. Yeah, we know. Tom's already been kind of, like, second guessing him. 

Kip:
[01:31:04 - 01:31:05]
Exactly. 

Amanda:
[01:31:05 - 01:31:13]
So, I mean, it does make sense. But what. What really matters in the moment is that Jack thinks they're dead. 

Kip:
[01:31:13 - 01:31:16]
Exactly. And he just beats the. Out of. 

Amanda:
[01:31:16 - 01:31:21]
And his acting. Matthew Fox's acting in that scene. He is such a good crier. 

Kip:
[01:31:21 - 01:31:22]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[01:31:22 - 01:31:32]
And he. That his reaction to that happening was so good. And then. Yeah. To just lose it on him because, like, he had to let that happen for the greater good of the group. 

Kip:
[01:31:32 - 01:31:37]
Yeah. And I. You're right. That does show growth because he never would have even a season ago. 

Amanda:
[01:31:38 - 01:31:52]
No, there's a few choices. Like, there's been this episode. Episodes, I should say, have a few kind of these crisis points for people. Right. Where they could hurt people or let people get hurt or make different choices. And a lot of people make choices that you wouldn't expect. Yeah, Right. 

Kip:
[01:31:52 - 01:32:38]
Like so. And that's crazy. This leads to one of my favorite scenes from the whole show. Jack Drake's been back all bloodied up and bruised, says he's coming with us and plops him down right in front of Alex. And Danielle walks up and just sort of looks at Alex. She's like, what do you want? And Ben says, alex, meet your mother. And then she just sort of has this beautiful moment where she's, like, touching her face and she's staring at each other. Staring at each other. Do you want to get some rope and help me tie him up? This is their first mother daughter moment. Like, tying up her fake father. 

Theresa:
[01:32:38 - 01:32:39]
Bonding. 

Kip:
[01:32:40 - 01:32:44]
Oh, it's so good. I love it so much. I just. It's so good. 

Theresa:
[01:32:45 - 01:32:54]
It is good. But the thing is, it's so perfectly Russo because she's got this, like, kind of smile on her face where, like, she's like, I've got my daughter back. This son of a. Is Gonna be. And it's, like, fantastic. 

Kip:
[01:32:54 - 01:32:55]
Yeah. For her, this is a good time. 

Amanda:
[01:32:55 - 01:32:56]
Yeah. 

Theresa:
[01:32:56 - 01:32:57]
She's like, that's great. 

Kip:
[01:32:57 - 01:32:57]
Yeah. 

Theresa:
[01:32:57 - 01:33:01]
Human interaction. Interaction with the person that I've been missing my whole life. 

Kip:
[01:33:01 - 01:33:04]
And it was done so well that it wasn't hokey or corny. 

Amanda:
[01:33:04 - 01:33:18]
Like, she's amazing, though, because later when she. When Jack or when Ben's being all loudmouthy and she eventually hits him in the face. She just hits him in the face and then just goes back to standing completely normal. Oh, my God. She's so amazing. 

Kip:
[01:33:19 - 01:33:24]
Yeah. So anyway, I don't remember what happens next. 

Theresa:
[01:33:25 - 01:33:32]
We see Jules and Sawyer. Well, we find out that there is no actual gun Cash. 

Kip:
[01:33:32 - 01:33:32]
Right. 

Theresa:
[01:33:32 - 01:33:39]
And then they're watching what's going on, and then the VW comes out because. 

Amanda:
[01:33:39 - 01:33:41]
They'Re having kind of conversation amongst themselves. 

Theresa:
[01:33:41 - 01:33:42]
Like, what are we gonna do? 

Amanda:
[01:33:42 - 01:33:54]
Saeed and Bernard and Jin are, like, literally hog tied with three men with guns on them, all obviously having their own internal thing. Juliet and Sway are kind of coming like, we have no weapons. We have no. Whatever. What the hell are we gonna do? 

Kip:
[01:33:54 - 01:34:00]
So I was like, well, wait till nightfall. And she's like, great. We still don't have any weapons. She's being so serious. 

Theresa:
[01:34:00 - 01:34:04]
Their interactions are so funny because she's hilarious. 

Kip:
[01:34:04 - 01:34:05]
Yeah. 

Theresa:
[01:34:05 - 01:34:10]
And he's still being serious, Sawyer. But he. Like, the looks on his face are like, yeah. 

Amanda:
[01:34:11 - 01:34:19]
And then Hurley. Mister, what are you gonna do? How are you gonna. Just comes in, literally, in the VW bus down. 

Kip:
[01:34:19 - 01:34:20]
Ryan. 

Theresa:
[01:34:20 - 01:34:20]
Yeah, Ryan, just. 

Amanda:
[01:34:21 - 01:34:25]
This is actually a very important scene. There's a few really cool things and very interesting things that happen. 

Theresa:
[01:34:25 - 01:34:26]
Very interesting. 

Amanda:
[01:34:26 - 01:34:36]
Because literally, when it's about to happen. Kip even said we were watching it. He's like, oh, I love this part. And it's when Saeed kicks out at the guy. 

Theresa:
[01:34:36 - 01:34:37]
Son of a. 

Amanda:
[01:34:37 - 01:34:41]
And then snaps his neck with his legs. 

Kip:
[01:34:41 - 01:34:42]
Yeah. Teresas. 

Theresa:
[01:34:43 - 01:34:45]
I have never wanted to be trapped between legs. 

Amanda:
[01:34:49 - 01:34:56]
Teresa, you know he killed a man, right? She's like, but damn. Like, that was very impressive. He was okay. But the worst. 

Theresa:
[01:34:56 - 01:35:12]
The crazy part is, it's like he's just. He's like, yeah, I'm defenseless. No, I'm not. You didn't tie my legs. You know what I mean? Like, that's wild to me, because I feel like for anybody else in that position, they're like, I'm gonna die. 

Kip:
[01:35:12 - 01:35:20]
Well, Bernard certainly wasn't a messier version, but he wouldn't have done it as smooth as saying no once. 

Amanda:
[01:35:20 - 01:35:29]
And it's. It just Shows, too, that he's smart. Right. Because he's like, I can't do it when there's three of them and three of us. And, like, those are not good odds. But once the. Starts to hit the. 

Kip:
[01:35:29 - 01:35:30]
Yeah. He saw an opportunity. 

Amanda:
[01:35:30 - 01:35:38]
He saw an opportunity, and he took it without thinking and executed it flawlessly. I don't condone violence, but that was. I mean, it's to protect themselves. So I got it. 

Theresa:
[01:35:39 - 01:35:41]
I mean, it was killer to be killed at that point. 

Kip:
[01:35:41 - 01:35:41]
Right. 

Amanda:
[01:35:41 - 01:35:50]
So we have Hurley coming in, doing this killer cool thing. We have say doing that. And then we have Sawyer, who is clearly still in dark Sawyer phase. 

Kip:
[01:35:50 - 01:35:51]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[01:35:51 - 01:35:53]
Because he walks up to Tom. 

Kip:
[01:35:54 - 01:35:57]
Well, Juliet's got him by the gunpoint. Yeah, Tom, you're done. 

Amanda:
[01:35:58 - 01:36:13]
He's like, all right. Puts his hands up in surrender. And. And. And Sawyer shoots him like, point blank. And then J.Y. kind of comes up or. Sorry, he said. And he says very poignantly, that's for. 

Kip:
[01:36:13 - 01:36:16]
Taking the kid off the raft. We forgot. 

Amanda:
[01:36:16 - 01:36:17]
We will talk about that. 

Kip:
[01:36:17 - 01:36:33]
No, we forgot. When Jack beat the. Out of Ben and he grabs the walkie, and he says, tom, I'm gonna get all these people off the island, and then I am going to find you and kill you. He is so pissed. I loved that scene. I was like, wow. 

Amanda:
[01:36:33 - 01:36:37]
Especially because him and Tom were actually friendly. 

Theresa:
[01:36:37 - 01:36:38]
Yeah. 

Kip:
[01:36:38 - 01:36:41]
Yeah. Right. How far they've come from that football game. 

Amanda:
[01:36:41 - 01:36:54]
And he. And I have no doubt in my mind that Jack would have forgotten all the goodwill that he had towards. And. And, like, quite honestly, like, don't get me wrong, because when Sawyer shoots him, he says this for taking the kid off the raft. And is it Hurley that says. 

Theresa:
[01:36:55 - 01:36:57]
Hurley says he's surrendering. 

Amanda:
[01:36:57 - 01:36:59]
He said. I didn't believe him or whatever. 

Kip:
[01:36:59 - 01:36:59]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[01:37:00 - 01:37:05]
Look, again, I don't condone violence, but I. I can completely understand why Sawyer did that. 

Kip:
[01:37:05 - 01:37:06]
Yeah. 

Theresa:
[01:37:06 - 01:37:06]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[01:37:06 - 01:37:07]
And I think Jack would have done the same. 

Kip:
[01:37:07 - 01:37:10]
I think so, too. They're done with these people. They're done. 

Theresa:
[01:37:10 - 01:37:11]
It's too much. 

Kip:
[01:37:11 - 01:37:13]
Playing their games, like. 

Amanda:
[01:37:13 - 01:37:15]
And at the end of the day, like, let's. Let's remember that. 

Kip:
[01:37:15 - 01:37:15]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[01:37:15 - 01:37:25]
Like, as much as Tom's this kind of benevolent, like, giant at this point, they did steal a man's child from his arm and then shoot Sawyer, and. 

Kip:
[01:37:25 - 01:37:27]
Then the group throw a bomb on the raft. 

Amanda:
[01:37:27 - 01:37:28]
Like. 

Theresa:
[01:37:28 - 01:37:39]
Like, it was like, they're not innocent in any way, shape, or form. And I think that sometimes, especially when it comes to Tom, because he's, like, kind of, like. Kind of, like, jovial, lovable. 

Amanda:
[01:37:40 - 01:37:40]
Yeah. 

Theresa:
[01:37:40 - 01:37:49]
Like, you can kind of. You're all almost like, oh, yeah. You know, like, he's not really, like, a big part. He's just kind of like a plan. Like, he's just kind of, you know, doing whatever Ben wants, but, like, really, he's no better. 

Amanda:
[01:37:49 - 01:37:52]
No, they're all very dangerous. 

Kip:
[01:37:52 - 01:37:55]
He literally just said in the previous scene, we should have just killed them. 

Theresa:
[01:37:55 - 01:37:55]
Yeah. 

Kip:
[01:37:55 - 01:38:14]
Like, he's coldblooded. So it. It's all starting to convalesce. Everything's getting wrapped up, and Hurley has this really cute sort of. Hey, others, if you're listening to this, your plan didn't work. We're okay. And Jack's like, hurley, like, I thought. 

Amanda:
[01:38:14 - 01:38:15]
You were in the back row. 

Kip:
[01:38:16 - 01:38:21]
Yeah. Again, what we're. He did not realize Hurley was missing for a very long time. 

Amanda:
[01:38:22 - 01:38:32]
But that is a beautiful scene because then it's like, I'm here with Sawyer, Juliet, and then he's like, everyone. And then he says, and Jin and Saeed and Bernard, and they're just so happy they're alive. 

Kip:
[01:38:32 - 01:38:34]
Exactly. Yeah. It was so beautiful. 

Amanda:
[01:38:34 - 01:38:47]
And it's just like sun and Rose are relieved and Jack obviously thinking they were dead and having told Kate that as well. Yeah, everyone's so relieved. But then they get kind of unseen. Did we talk about locked? 

Kip:
[01:38:47 - 01:38:48]
No, we did not. 

Theresa:
[01:38:48 - 01:38:49]
We're not there. 

Kip:
[01:38:50 - 01:38:56]
Oh, yeah, no, no, I think we did see that. We've just missed it in the. Chronologically. 

Theresa:
[01:38:57 - 01:38:57]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[01:38:58 - 01:39:02]
John's alive and needed a pep talk from a ghost child. 

Kip:
[01:39:02 - 01:39:19]
We. We should talk about that scene, though. Like, so he's dying. Dying. He finds a revolver, and for all intents and purposes, it looks like he's about to. Yeah. What did you think of that? Because he's trying to move his legs. He can't move his legs. Like, is he just. 

Amanda:
[01:39:19 - 01:39:21]
Like, I can't do this. 

Kip:
[01:39:21 - 01:39:22]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[01:39:22 - 01:39:34]
I mean, if you were in a pit of bones with a gunshot wound in your belly and your leg's not working for the 18th time, what would you think? 

Kip:
[01:39:34 - 01:39:40]
Well, I mean. Yeah. I don't know, but it just. It seemed like John was. Yeah, he was given up. 

Theresa:
[01:39:41 - 01:39:54]
Yeah, he was. He definitely felt defeated at that point, which, I mean, fair enough. I mean, things look pretty bleak. But just as he's about to. Pew. Pew, we hear a familiar voice. 

Kip:
[01:39:55 - 01:39:56]
Because, I guess. 

Amanda:
[01:39:56 - 01:39:57]
Do we hear a familiar voice? 

Kip:
[01:39:57 - 01:40:16]
I'm still on the John Locke thing. Like, I guess, because at first I'm like, why is he giving up so quick? He's so. Such a believer in the island. He's such A believer in that it heals and that it. It is his destiny, blah, blah, blah. But I guess coming off of two episodes ago where he's seen this whole smoke show. 

Theresa:
[01:40:17 - 01:40:17]
Yeah. 

Kip:
[01:40:17 - 01:40:40]
But then he also heard Jacob, though, when Ben didn't. And he knows Ben didn't. So, like, he's heard something supernatural, for lack of a better word. You would think he would have a little bit more in him to be like, I gotta keep going. There's something here on this island that literally just spoke to me and not the leader of the others. But he's so quick to give up. 

Theresa:
[01:40:40 - 01:41:12]
I think it's just like a weak point for him because, like, he believed so fully in something being more than what it was. And then for it to be like you said, like this, like, smoke and mirrors, like, fakey thing. And yeah, he did hear something, but, like, now he's lying here, like, is this really his destiny? Like, it makes me believe that maybe he's like. He was like, kind of questioning. He feels a little bit, like, foolish and he's not really sure. And I think, like, John's the kind of person who just like, when he shook, he's like, really shook. 

Kip:
[01:41:12 - 01:41:12]
Yeah. 

Theresa:
[01:41:12 - 01:41:21]
And I think, like, being in the situation that he's in, like, kind of compounded onto that and that's what kind of brought him to this, like, extreme low. 

Amanda:
[01:41:21 - 01:41:29]
But I think he, like, building on that. I think that he just is sick of being like, well, if I'm supposed to be so special, why does everything keep. 

Kip:
[01:41:29 - 01:41:31]
Why does all the bad stuff keep happening? 

Amanda:
[01:41:31 - 01:41:32]
Right? 

Kip:
[01:41:32 - 01:41:34]
Like, all these trials, tribulations. 

Amanda:
[01:41:34 - 01:41:40]
And then I just laugh at you saying, we hear a familiar voice because there's something going on with that kid's voice. 

Theresa:
[01:41:40 - 01:41:41]
Yeah. Helium. 

Kip:
[01:41:41 - 01:41:51]
Well, I. Yeah. And yeah, there's. They digitally altered it or had him breathe in some helium to make it sound a bit more high pitched. 

Theresa:
[01:41:51 - 01:42:12]
And he's. He's so tall. And the angle, it's unfortunate because Jack, or not Jack, John is below him. So in order for it to like, you know, look like he's looking up or whatever at. At Walt, it has to be from that angle because straight on doesn't make any sense. But you're taking a very tall man now and made him even taller. 

Amanda:
[01:42:12 - 01:42:13]
Yeah, yeah. 

Theresa:
[01:42:13 - 01:42:16]
With this weird voice that sounds mechanical. 

Kip:
[01:42:17 - 01:42:25]
So do you think it was Walt, like. Or is he just imagining this? What do you think? Because it's kind of weird. Walt just appears. 

Amanda:
[01:42:25 - 01:42:53]
Yeah. And it's weird to me, like, I feel like it has to be Walt because why would John. Like, I know they had their connection early on in season one or whatever, but, like, of all the people that could appear to John to like, be like, here's the pep talk. Like, it's not Helen. It's not his dad. Like, you know, kind of coaxing him in like a half bullying way. It's not Jack. It's not whatever. Like, I don't know. It just felt like that's who. He wouldn't manifest necessarily in a moment like that. 

Kip:
[01:42:53 - 01:43:19]
Yeah. I feel. And I don't know this. I haven't read this anywhere. I don't remember if there ever is a real explanation or not, but we were sort of led to believe Walt had some, like, supernatural abilities of his own. So I feel like there's almost like a shining thing going on where Walt's probably off island with Michael somewhere, and he feels this moment of John Locke's despair and sort of shinings himself. Have you seen the Shining? 

Theresa:
[01:43:19 - 01:43:19]
No. 

Kip:
[01:43:19 - 01:43:34]
Oh, okay. That's why I'm like, okay, so in the. In the Shining, that kind of stuff happens. I won't go into it, but that's what made it made me think of, like, maybe it's like Walt's not physically there, but he's just sort of. Yeah. Been like, John needs me to give him. 

Theresa:
[01:43:35 - 01:43:38]
You can kind of see that. I mean, from one special boy to another. 

Kip:
[01:43:38 - 01:43:41]
Yeah. Kind of thing. And then that's it. It was very weird. 

Amanda:
[01:43:42 - 01:43:44]
And then we don't really see Johnny yet. 

Kip:
[01:43:44 - 01:43:45]
New. Well, until. 

Amanda:
[01:43:46 - 01:43:46]
Until. 

Kip:
[01:43:46 - 01:43:47]
Yeah. Okay. Yeah. 

Amanda:
[01:43:48 - 01:43:51]
So now it's kind of all kind of coalescing into this big. 

Kip:
[01:43:51 - 01:43:53]
The good news. Everything's working out. Yeah. 

Amanda:
[01:43:53 - 01:43:58]
Oh, my God. We can, you know, the lights on and we can make the phone call. 

Theresa:
[01:43:58 - 01:44:07]
And everyone's alive, but it's not his mouth. It's still playing through the Dang 4 to satellite phone. We got to turn it off. 

Amanda:
[01:44:07 - 01:44:08]
They turn that off. 

Kip:
[01:44:08 - 01:44:14]
That's funny, cuz. Rs, like, I haven't been here in 16 years. Boink. Press the button, it's off. 

Theresa:
[01:44:14 - 01:44:17]
Yep. She ejects the tape, puts it on top. 

Kip:
[01:44:17 - 01:44:26]
And then it's like. Because we don't need more, like, tension. Oh, I can't get a signal in here. I have to leave. So they leave and she's making the. 

Theresa:
[01:44:26 - 01:44:33]
Call and then knife in the back from her mouth. 

Kip:
[01:44:33 - 01:44:43]
But, like, I do not remember Ben, like, pleading with them, like, not to make that phone call, etc, but, like, while he's tied up. 

Amanda:
[01:44:43 - 01:44:56]
Yeah. I don't know. Like, and this is where, like, God damn It. Ben Linus. Michael Emerson Carlton Cuse. Damon Lindelof. I'm sending everyone my therapy bills because I still am. Like, should we be listening to him? 

Kip:
[01:44:56 - 01:44:57]
I know. 

Amanda:
[01:44:57 - 01:44:58]
It's very convincing. 

Kip:
[01:44:58 - 01:45:04]
I know. Because he's very convincing that you start believing, like, they maybe are making a mistake. 

Amanda:
[01:45:04 - 01:45:05]
Yeah. 

Theresa:
[01:45:05 - 01:45:09]
You can't help but, like, think and have that, like, seed of doubt. 

Kip:
[01:45:10 - 01:45:12]
Especially after. Not Penny's boat. 

Theresa:
[01:45:12 - 01:45:13]
Well, exactly. 

Kip:
[01:45:13 - 01:45:17]
Right. Like, they're calling someone, thinking it's something very different. 

Amanda:
[01:45:17 - 01:45:17]
Yeah. 

Kip:
[01:45:17 - 01:45:26]
And Ben sort of knows it's different, and then. Yeah. Knife in the back. That's very anime sound. 

Theresa:
[01:45:26 - 01:45:27]
Blood down her chin. 

Kip:
[01:45:27 - 01:45:30]
I mean, he has a gun. Why'd he do the knife thing? 

Amanda:
[01:45:30 - 01:45:32]
Like, is that just better with a knife? 

Theresa:
[01:45:32 - 01:45:34]
Remember in season one, he was just going. 

Kip:
[01:45:34 - 01:45:44]
Yeah. Yeah. So. And. And just like, my God. It just. There's so much going on. Ben's yelling, kill him, John. 

Amanda:
[01:45:44 - 01:45:44]
Kill him. 

Kip:
[01:45:44 - 01:45:59]
Like, to kill Jack. Like, Jesus Christ, Ben. And then Danielle knocks him out, thankfully. And it's just, like, all this stuff going on. Also, John's not gonna listen to you. You just shot him. That was literally an hour ago. 

Theresa:
[01:45:59 - 01:46:03]
And then Jack goes to get the phone, and then John shoots it at the ground that he. Yeah. 

Kip:
[01:46:03 - 01:46:06]
Yeah. Very dramatic. It's so much going on. 

Amanda:
[01:46:06 - 01:46:11]
Interesting scene, though, because, like, Jack kind of calls John's bluff again. 

Kip:
[01:46:11 - 01:46:12]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[01:46:12 - 01:46:15]
And John does not shoot him. 

Kip:
[01:46:15 - 01:46:15]
No. 

Amanda:
[01:46:16 - 01:46:19]
Even though John clearly believes fully. 

Kip:
[01:46:19 - 01:46:19]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[01:46:20 - 01:46:22]
That what? That this is going to be a problem. 

Kip:
[01:46:22 - 01:46:22]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[01:46:22 - 01:46:24]
Right. And that he shouldn't have. He shouldn't be doing this. 

Kip:
[01:46:24 - 01:46:26]
And he says, I will kill you. 

Amanda:
[01:46:26 - 01:46:26]
Yeah. 

Kip:
[01:46:26 - 01:46:28]
But you're right. He calls out his bluff. 

Amanda:
[01:46:28 - 01:46:29]
He can't do it. 

Kip:
[01:46:29 - 01:46:29]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[01:46:29 - 01:46:53]
Because there's also a moment of growth for Locke, which is, for the first time in a long time, the, like, higher purpose. The island is telling me to do this. Like, it has to be done. Jacob. Whatever. You know, kind of mythical, mystical reasons John has for doing stuff that has led to things like Boone dying. 

Kip:
[01:46:53 - 01:46:53]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[01:46:53 - 01:47:00]
And, like, lies and manipulations as well on his part. He actually chooses Jack. 

Kip:
[01:47:00 - 01:47:00]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[01:47:00 - 01:47:02]
And Jack's life. 

Kip:
[01:47:02 - 01:47:02]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[01:47:02 - 01:47:04]
Which is very big. 

Kip:
[01:47:04 - 01:47:06]
It is. And you just hear him say, like, oh, Jack. 

Theresa:
[01:47:07 - 01:47:07]
Yep. 

Amanda:
[01:47:07 - 01:47:09]
Like, you're gonna regret this. 

Kip:
[01:47:09 - 01:47:14]
Yeah. Like, he's just. He's choosing to not kill him. But it's also just like, you don't really know what you're doing. 

Amanda:
[01:47:14 - 01:47:15]
And, like, I'm out of here. 

Kip:
[01:47:15 - 01:47:17]
Yeah. Jack is pissed. 

Theresa:
[01:47:17 - 01:47:20]
Oh. 100. But also locked. You know what you are doing? 

Kip:
[01:47:20 - 01:47:21]
No. Exactly. 

Theresa:
[01:47:21 - 01:47:30]
Like, you came out of nowhere. You believe that they shouldn't do this. At this point. I don't even know if you know why. 

Kip:
[01:47:30 - 01:47:30]
Yeah. 

Theresa:
[01:47:30 - 01:47:37]
Are you doing it because you did. You still don't want to get off the island because you think you. I don't know. Like, it's just so many. 

Kip:
[01:47:37 - 01:47:48]
Well, it is. It's a lot going on. And it just begs a question. Like, same thing we asked Ben. We're asking John. What do you care? Just stay behind. Let them do their thing. 

Theresa:
[01:47:48 - 01:47:48]
Yeah. 

Kip:
[01:47:48 - 01:47:52]
But he clearly believes something very, very bad is going to come from this. 

Theresa:
[01:47:52 - 01:47:53]
Yeah. It's nuts. 

Kip:
[01:47:53 - 01:48:01]
And then he just disappears. But Jack makes the call. And basically the people on the boat say, hang tight. We're coming for you. Whoa. 

Amanda:
[01:48:01 - 01:48:02]
Yeah. 

Theresa:
[01:48:02 - 01:48:04]
And then there is joy on everyone's faces. 

Amanda:
[01:48:05 - 01:48:20]
Yeah. And so we're led to believe on island, where we're at, which is, we're rescued, they're coming for us. We're elated. Everyone who needs to be here and happy and alive is here and happy and alive. And then it cuts to the airport. The airport. 

Kip:
[01:48:21 - 01:48:23]
Flashback, flash. 

Theresa:
[01:48:23 - 01:48:26]
At this point, Teresa still believes. Flashback. 

Kip:
[01:48:26 - 01:48:29]
And pulls up in his cool Ford Bronco. 

Theresa:
[01:48:29 - 01:48:35]
And then a sedan pulls up. A lady gets out. It's Kate. 

Kip:
[01:48:35 - 01:48:45]
I do. I do remember watching, actually, because this scene, I remember thinking in the moment, like, oh, I guess they knew each other. 

Amanda:
[01:48:46 - 01:48:46]
Everyone thought that. 

Kip:
[01:48:46 - 01:48:50]
Yeah. Before. Oh, this is quite the, like, curveball. 

Theresa:
[01:48:50 - 01:48:52]
I know. That's what I thought. 

Amanda:
[01:48:52 - 01:48:54]
How come they never mentioned it? 

Kip:
[01:48:54 - 01:48:54]
Yeah. Right. 

Theresa:
[01:48:54 - 01:48:56]
And I was like, this can't be right. 

Amanda:
[01:48:56 - 01:48:56]
Yeah. 

Theresa:
[01:48:56 - 01:48:59]
This is where I started to be like. Like, hold on. 

Kip:
[01:48:59 - 01:49:02]
I remember you saying that. Hold on. What? 

Amanda:
[01:49:02 - 01:49:09]
I remember thinking that exact thing, though, Kip. When I first watched it, I was like, oh, did they, like, cross paths briefly at one point and. For God. Or something. 

Kip:
[01:49:10 - 01:49:26]
And then. Oh, man. And she's just. So he's talking about the funeral, and he's very visibly upset again. And she clearly doesn't really want to be there. She's, like, very uncomfortable. And he says, I thought you might go. And she's just, like, disgusted by the idea. 

Amanda:
[01:49:27 - 01:49:27]
Yeah. 

Theresa:
[01:49:28 - 01:49:29]
Yeah. Again, why? 

Kip:
[01:49:30 - 01:49:35]
And then basically, he tells her, kate, we made a mistake. We gotta go back. 

Theresa:
[01:49:36 - 01:49:38]
It's when he's like, okay, Crazy person. 

Kip:
[01:49:38 - 01:49:38]
Yeah. 

Theresa:
[01:49:38 - 01:49:41]
Yeah. Because he's like, we. I've been using the golden Pass. 

Kip:
[01:49:41 - 01:49:42]
Yes. Yeah. 

Theresa:
[01:49:42 - 01:49:46]
That they gave us. And I was like, what on earth is a golden pass? And he's like, I've been flying. I'm like, flying. 

Amanda:
[01:49:46 - 01:49:48]
Which segue quickly. 

Kip:
[01:49:48 - 01:49:49]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[01:49:49 - 01:49:50]
What a. What a deal. 

Kip:
[01:49:50 - 01:49:52]
Yeah. Survival. 

Theresa:
[01:49:52 - 01:49:52]
Sorry. 

Amanda:
[01:49:52 - 01:50:00]
That you crash on One of our planes and we're on a deserted island for 90 plus days. But now you can fly anywhere you want for the rest of your life. Thank you. Please, please choose Oceanic. 

Kip:
[01:50:03 - 01:50:08]
But yeah, that was a. That was a good monologue because, like, he's just trying to get back. Yeah. 

Theresa:
[01:50:08 - 01:50:12]
He's like, every time there's like a bit of turbulence, I close my eyes and pray. 

Kip:
[01:50:13 - 01:50:14]
Don't care what anyone else. 

Theresa:
[01:50:14 - 01:50:14]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[01:50:14 - 01:50:16]
That to me was like the wildest. 

Theresa:
[01:50:16 - 01:50:23]
Like, I got goosebumps when you say that. I'm like, you are so far gone. I do not know what happened happen to you between then and now. 

Kip:
[01:50:23 - 01:50:23]
Yeah. 

Theresa:
[01:50:24 - 01:50:29]
But like the fact that this is what you want to happen, you don't care about anybody else. 

Kip:
[01:50:29 - 01:50:29]
Yeah. 

Theresa:
[01:50:30 - 01:50:31]
Like what has happened to you. 

Kip:
[01:50:31 - 01:50:40]
Yeah. And she just walks away. She says, oh, she says, he'll be wondering where I've been. And we don't know who that is yet. We do find out. 

Theresa:
[01:50:41 - 01:50:42]
But we do. 

Amanda:
[01:50:42 - 01:50:43]
Oh, yeah. 

Kip:
[01:50:43 - 01:50:44]
Yeah. Absolutely. 

Theresa:
[01:50:44 - 01:50:45]
A hundy person. 

Kip:
[01:50:45 - 01:50:51]
And then it's the bangest of all banger endings. I've said that so many times. But it's like this one for sure. 

Theresa:
[01:50:52 - 01:50:54]
This is the banger of banger. 

Kip:
[01:50:54 - 01:50:58]
One of my. I think it's my all time favorite season finale. 

Theresa:
[01:50:58 - 01:50:59]
Really? 

Amanda:
[01:50:59 - 01:50:59]
Me too. 

Kip:
[01:50:59 - 01:51:06]
Because we have to go back, Kate. We have to go back. Mind. 

Amanda:
[01:51:07 - 01:51:08]
I know. 

Kip:
[01:51:08 - 01:51:09]
Of the mindest of all. 

Amanda:
[01:51:10 - 01:51:11]
I know. 

Kip:
[01:51:11 - 01:51:13]
Yeah. Oh, just so well done. 

Theresa:
[01:51:13 - 01:51:17]
I don't even remember the other finale. So I can't even be like, this is my favorite. 

Amanda:
[01:51:17 - 01:51:21]
Oh, when I say finales, I meant of all time. Every TV show ever. Not just Lost. 

Kip:
[01:51:21 - 01:51:22]
No. It's so good. 

Amanda:
[01:51:23 - 01:51:24]
It's so good. 

Kip:
[01:51:24 - 01:51:29]
Yeah. So, I mean, wow. We made it, guys. 

Theresa:
[01:51:30 - 01:51:33]
That was two episodes of Just Mind. 

Amanda:
[01:51:34 - 01:51:38]
It's just like, honestly cannot be overstated how amazing it is. 

Kip:
[01:51:38 - 01:51:38]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[01:51:38 - 01:51:52]
Like, it's just such insane storytelling. It's just. I just sit here, I'm like half lying down because I'm just like in awe of it. Because I was in awe when we watched it and now we've talked about it and I'm just thinking about those feelings again. 

Kip:
[01:51:52 - 01:52:09]
Well, and just like the level to get us to this place, like the level of storytelling, like this is so good on its own, but just what it took to get us here and all the layers being laid out and everything being set up and. Ugh, it's just to get us here. And we still have three more seasons. 

Amanda:
[01:52:09 - 01:52:19]
I know we're gonna find out what exactly happened to make him go from. I'm getting These people off the island. And I'll let my three friends die to do it to. We have to go back. 

Kip:
[01:52:19 - 01:52:20]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[01:52:20 - 01:52:38]
Like. And that is just insane. And. And that's why, like, you know, some people might say, why do we have the slow burn of, like, his flashback, this episode or whatever? It's like, because you have to see how. How destroyed he is and what he's willing to do to himself. That's how wrong he. That's how wrong he feels he was. 

Kip:
[01:52:38 - 01:52:39]
Exactly. 

Amanda:
[01:52:39 - 01:52:46]
And for him, of all people, to think that it's bad, or at least that's what I'm thinking at this point. It's bad. Yeah, it's gonna be bad. 

Kip:
[01:52:46 - 01:52:47]
Bad. 

Amanda:
[01:52:47 - 01:52:50]
And going, like, even from I love you, Kate to her not wanting anything to do with him, like. 

Kip:
[01:52:50 - 01:52:51]
Yeah, I know. 

Amanda:
[01:52:52 - 01:52:58]
And who else is off the island? Is everyone off the island? Did everyone make it? Like, it's. I remember there being so many questions. 

Kip:
[01:52:58 - 01:52:58]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[01:52:59 - 01:53:05]
Luckily, I watched this after it aired, so I could immediately go to the next episode. Kip had to wait two and a half months. 

Kip:
[01:53:05 - 01:53:05]
Yeah. 

Theresa:
[01:53:06 - 01:53:12]
I really want to know. Like, it's. It's. It's. It's intense and, like, I know we have to wait a whole. 

Kip:
[01:53:13 - 01:53:27]
Well, while. We're gonna take a short hiatus between seasons. Not too long, but we're gonna take a little short hiatus. But we'll be back at it before we're not done yet because we still got to find out where these characters ended. How did they end season. 

Theresa:
[01:53:28 - 01:54:42]
Okay, here we go. At number 13, we have Mr. Benjamin Linus with negative 685. Then at number 12, we have, for the very last time, Charlie Pace. RIP Charlie Hieronymous Pace, negative 100. Then we have Juliet. At number 11, 535, we have Claire. Number 10 with 840. Desmond Hume at 925. Catherine Austin with 1010. John Locke. 1185. Jin Kwon. Jin Soo Kwon. 1740. Sun Hwa Kwan. 1,775. Jack Shepard. 1,865. James Sawyer Ford. 2045. Saeed Jarrah. Number 2, 26, 95. And at number one for the season and the series for right now and my heart and all of our hearts, the King, Hugo Hurley Reyes. 3020. 

Amanda:
[01:54:42 - 01:54:45]
How many did you gain for that bus maneuver? 

Theresa:
[01:54:46 - 01:54:53]
Well, he went from 2,920 to 3,020. So 100 points. 

Kip:
[01:54:53 - 01:54:55]
That's not as much as I thought. 

Amanda:
[01:54:55 - 01:54:56]
It was a thousand points. 

Theresa:
[01:54:56 - 01:54:57]
It was not. 

Amanda:
[01:54:57 - 01:54:59]
I'm gonna give my own points. I give it A thousand points. 

Kip:
[01:54:59 - 01:55:04]
Because it started with the two and then went up to a three. 

Theresa:
[01:55:05 - 01:55:07]
No, the person who gained. 

Kip:
[01:55:07 - 01:55:10]
I thought so too. You went up a thousand points. 

Theresa:
[01:55:10 - 01:55:12]
Charlie gained the most points this episode. 

Amanda:
[01:55:12 - 01:55:14]
Well, he made a big sacrifice. 

Kip:
[01:55:14 - 01:55:15]
Yeah. Okay. 

Amanda:
[01:55:15 - 01:55:16]
Okay. 

Theresa:
[01:55:16 - 01:55:20]
Goodbye, Charlie. Charlie. Hieronymus Pace. 

Kip:
[01:55:22 - 01:55:23]
I'll start us off. 

Theresa:
[01:55:23 - 01:55:23]
Okay. 

Kip:
[01:55:23 - 01:55:24]
With the ranks. 

Theresa:
[01:55:24 - 01:55:24]
Okay. 

Kip:
[01:55:24 - 01:55:35]
Ratings. I am giving season three, episode 2223 an 11 out of 10. 

Theresa:
[01:55:35 - 01:55:38]
Oh, and soft the charts. 

Kip:
[01:55:39 - 01:55:48]
It's literally off the charts. And a let's Get Lost first Y skyrocketed through the ceiling. That's all I have to say. 

Amanda:
[01:55:48 - 01:56:29]
I. I didn't know we could. I'm giving it an 11 out of 10 as well. I agree. This is like. This is. I wasn't. I was being a little bit facetious, obviously, but when I say this was my favorite finale of all time, I'm serious when I say it's up there for every show I've ever watched ever. Like, it's just so good. It's so many people's favorite episodes for a reason. It's peak storytelling. I'm so sad to say goodbye to Charlie, but it was such a beautiful way to have him go. We haven't lost a character in a while that we, like, are this invested in, and it was a very good way for him to go. And like I said, Jack's growing, Lock's growing. I was surprised. I was surprised. 

Kip:
[01:56:29 - 01:56:30]
Humanity and Ben. 

Amanda:
[01:56:31 - 01:56:38]
Yeah, there's humanity and Ben. Everyone is just like. It almost feels like it's. It couldn't have been written. 

Kip:
[01:56:38 - 01:56:39]
Yeah. 

Amanda:
[01:56:39 - 01:56:46]
Like it has to have been live real life. Like, I know it isn't, but anyway, it's a lot. I agree. 11 out of 10. 

Theresa:
[01:56:48 - 01:56:59]
Now the real question is, is T Dog gonna go off the charts or is she gonna be cool and stay within the boundaries, the confines, if you will, of 1 to 10? 

Kip:
[01:57:03 - 01:57:04]
She's doing her own drum roll. 

Theresa:
[01:57:06 - 01:57:21]
T Dog gives it an 11 out of 10. We've got, for the first time in let's Get Lost history, an off the charts episode. So good I did not cry because I do not have feelings. 

Amanda:
[01:57:21 - 01:57:22]
Or tear ducks. 

Theresa:
[01:57:22 - 01:57:39]
Or tear ducks, apparently. But I loved this episode. I think it is storytelling at its peak. I have seen this series twice through and I still did not remember that these were flash forwards. What the. That is good. That has me so hooked that I don't even remember. 

Kip:
[01:57:39 - 01:57:40]
Nice. 

Amanda:
[01:57:41 - 01:57:42]
Amazing. 

Kip:
[01:57:42 - 01:58:04]
Amazing. Well, thank you everybody for tuning in for another season of let's Get Lost. We really appreciate it. It. We love having you along with the ride. For along on the ride with us. Thank you to everyone for subscribing to our Patreon. Those of you who do. We really appreciate it and it really does mean a lot to us to help us keep this going. And and we're going to be back for season four after a short little break. 

Amanda:
[01:58:05 - 01:58:19]
Follow us on social media if you want to know exactly when. We'll post a few things between now and then, but that's the best way to know exactly when we're coming back. But we don't want to wait that long either cuz we're really hitting our stride with these episodes. 

Theresa:
[01:58:19 - 01:58:20]
So hell yeah. 

Amanda:
[01:58:20 - 01:58:21]
See you soon. 

Theresa:
[01:58:21 - 01:58:22]
Bye.